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Tomasz Grysztar



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 7725
Location: Kraków, Poland
Tomasz Grysztar
As perhaps noone noticed Wink, yesterday I've updated the pages of this website (except for the messageboard) to XHTML 1.0 Strict (which IMO is a nice thing).

As for the messageboard, here comes the problem. Updating the skin to the same XHTML syntax would be quite a lot of job. So either I would need someone to help with it, or... The other option is to get a completely new skin, or even completely new forum software.

Thus I'm now opening discussion about how this board should look and what engine should it run on. Any constructive suggestions are welcome - in particular, if you would like to propose some alternative forum software, please give some information about its strong and weak points.
Post 08 Feb 2009, 14:49
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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revolution
What is involved with updating the skin syntax? I don't mind giving some time to help.

If you change the forum software then:

I would give preference to forum software that supports non-JS browsers.

I would give preference to forum software that can search reliably.

I would give preference to forum software that can find all posts in the last day.
Post 08 Feb 2009, 16:27
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MHajduk



Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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MHajduk
Support for blue links really can make life easier. Wink
Post 08 Feb 2009, 19:18
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
As perhaps noone noticed Wink, today I've updated the pages of the fasmarm website to XHTML 1.0 Strict.

Check out the validation.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 12:16
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
Tomasz: Can I just download the phpBB software and edit that? Are you using a standard version?
Post 09 Feb 2009, 12:24
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Tomasz Grysztar



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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Location: Kraków, Poland
Tomasz Grysztar
revolution wrote:
Tomasz: Can I just download the phpBB software and edit that? Are you using a standard version?

No, it's not standard. It was modified in some places exclusively for this board.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 12:54
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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revolution
Do you want to post the code here so we can all make changes? Or do you prefer to keep it private with just a few helpers? What is your plan?
Post 09 Feb 2009, 13:11
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Tomasz Grysztar



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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Tomasz Grysztar
I prefer to keep it private.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 13:14
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
I don't mind giving some time to help.

However: keep in mind that I am a complete noob with websites. But I am a fast learner.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 13:17
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Tomasz Grysztar



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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Location: Kraków, Poland
Tomasz Grysztar
revolution wrote:
I would give preference to forum software that can search reliably.

Can you give an example where current search fails? Maybe it's something I could work on.

MHajduk wrote:
Support for blue links really can make life easier.

OK. Done. Wink

revolution wrote:
I don't mind giving some time to help.

Thank you for your readiness. If we decide to go on with upgrading the current skin, I will make a working copy of it (for testing) and give you FTP access to the files.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 16:45
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
revolution wrote:
I would give preference to forum software that can search reliably.

Can you give an example where current search fails? Maybe it's something I could work on.
see here
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
MHajduk wrote:
Support for blue links really can make life easier.

OK. Done. Wink
Okay I'm gonna try in this message. See above link.
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
Thank you for your readiness. If we decide to go on with upgrading the current skin, I will make a working copy of it (for testing) and give you FTP access to the files.
Sounds sensible.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 16:53
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MHajduk



Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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MHajduk
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
MHajduk wrote:
Support for blue links really can make life easier.
OK. Done. Wink
Thank you, Tomasz. Very Happy
Post 09 Feb 2009, 17:28
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drhowarddrfine



Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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drhowarddrfine
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
As perhaps noone noticed Wink, yesterday I've updated the pages of this website (except for the messageboard) to XHTML 1.0 Strict (which IMO is a nice thing).
Um. Well. No, you did not. All you did was add the XHTML stuff at the beginning of the page but you still aren't serving it as XHTML so all browsers only interpret it as broken HTML. So it's questionable that you gain anything from doing that other than learning how XHTML tags work and are validated.

One important issue. You properly inserted the xml declaration on the first line but only modern browsers know what that is while IE<7 chokes and goes into quirks mode and IE7 and IE8 ignore it altogether since no version of IE handles XHTML. You can safely remove this:
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>

Notice I have utf-8 which is what all pages should be using anyway.
Post 09 Feb 2009, 18:24
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Tomasz Grysztar



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
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Tomasz Grysztar
Are you talking about the message board pages here? Because, as I said, I updated the pages except for the message board.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 11:06
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
drhowarddrfine wrote:
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
As perhaps noone noticed Wink, yesterday I've updated the pages of this website (except for the messageboard) to XHTML 1.0 Strict (which IMO is a nice thing).
Um. Well. No, you did not. All you did was add the XHTML stuff at the beginning of the page but you still aren't serving it as XHTML so all browsers only interpret it as broken HTML. So it's questionable that you gain anything from doing that other than learning how XHTML tags work and are validated.

One important issue. You properly inserted the xml declaration on the first line but only modern browsers know what that is while IE<7 chokes and goes into quirks mode and IE7 and IE8 ignore it altogether since no version of IE handles XHTML. You can safely remove this:
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?>

Notice I have utf-8 which is what all pages should be using anyway.
Can you check the fasmarm page? I think I have fixed it up now to be properly compliant. Thanks.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 11:50
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
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sleepsleep
if the idea of changing the forum board software already exists... why not just build one from scratch... may take months to year. but eventually, something that.... we could be proud of.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 13:49
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drhowarddrfine



Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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drhowarddrfine
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
Are you talking about the message board pages here? Because, as I said, I updated the pages except for the message board.

I was talking of this page. Either I looked at it wrong or forgot to clear my cache but you are serving it correctly now. Are you serving IE differently? IE cannot display application/xhtml+xml. I'm not on Windows so I can't check.

Revolution, yours is correct also.


Last edited by drhowarddrfine on 10 Feb 2009, 13:59; edited 1 time in total
Post 10 Feb 2009, 13:54
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
Thanks for checking.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 13:57
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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Location: In your JS exploiting you and your system
revolution
drhowarddrfine wrote:
Are you serving IE differently? IE cannot display application/xhtml+xml.
Tomasz taught me how to scan the "HTTP_ACCEPT" for xhtml and now it serves a different header for non-xhtml (IE) browsers.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 14:01
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drhowarddrfine



Joined: 10 Jul 2007
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drhowarddrfine
Ok, that explains that. Congratulations on moving the web forward.

My current job uses some elements of HTML5 and is, essentially, a HTML5 site. I'd use XHTML2 but IE8 won't support XHTML either, and Microsoft has already stated IE9 won't.
Post 10 Feb 2009, 14:09
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