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Index > Heap > Comparison between Raw, Stripped, and Unstripped binaries

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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
No more giving back...No more giving back...


Last edited by kohlrak on 07 Aug 2008, 14:21; edited 1 time in total
Post 02 Aug 2008, 21:34
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mattst88



Joined: 12 May 2006
Posts: 260
Location: South Carolina
mattst88
Umm, what did you prove?
Post 05 Aug 2008, 17:13
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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
No more giving back...


Last edited by kohlrak on 07 Aug 2008, 14:22; edited 1 time in total
Post 05 Aug 2008, 19:16
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mattst88



Joined: 12 May 2006
Posts: 260
Location: South Carolina
mattst88
So gcc+stripping creates a larger binary than a raw binary? So what?
Post 06 Aug 2008, 14:22
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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
No more giving back...


Last edited by kohlrak on 07 Aug 2008, 14:22; edited 1 time in total
Post 06 Aug 2008, 17:14
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comrade



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 1137
Location: Russian Federation
comrade
get your facts straight
Post 06 Aug 2008, 18:03
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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
No more giving back...


Last edited by kohlrak on 07 Aug 2008, 14:23; edited 1 time in total
Post 06 Aug 2008, 18:06
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asmcoder



Joined: 02 Jun 2008
Posts: 784
asmcoder
[content deleted]


Last edited by asmcoder on 14 Aug 2009, 14:56; edited 1 time in total
Post 06 Aug 2008, 21:06
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mattst88



Joined: 12 May 2006
Posts: 260
Location: South Carolina
mattst88
kohlrak wrote:
If bigger and slower doesn't matter, blah blah blah


The only thing you've shown is that gcc produces ELF binaries larger than what FASM does. Is this a big deal? Create some benchmarks to show loading time. The difference between 4800 bytes and 1010 bytes in an executable is so unimportant, it can't even be stated. Trivial.

Also, bigger doesn't mean slower. For instance, a look-up-table is in many cases faster than a smaller implementation.

Quote:
so if you're just out to criticize me and my work with linux go somewhere else, for i think many people actually care about the size of their programs. If you wanna criticize optimizations, go to an HLL board instead.


I'm criticising you and your 'optimizations'? News to me. Looks to me like you're flying off the handle.

I still don't understand the significance of anything you've posted. Of course an ELF binary will be larger than a raw binary, even when stripped. What's your point?

By the way, Don't tell me to go somewhere else when you're using my code, dumbass.
Post 06 Aug 2008, 22:19
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f0dder



Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 3170
Location: Denmark
f0dder
This is the same age-old, pointless, boring and uninformed argument.

Try comparing the "bloat" of using gcc (or really, gnu ld - get your facts straight) on a real-world-size program. The verdict? In-sig-ni-fi-cant. There, spelled it out for you.

Optimizing is fine, but you're spending your time & energy on something with extremely diminishing returns. Once your programs grow, the "bloat" (which is actually mostly useful stuff like debug symbols and exception-handling stuff) takes up a smaller and smaller percentage of the target executable. And hey, even in your example, it's insignificant.

As for "worse than what visual studio outputs.", get a clue Smile
Post 06 Aug 2008, 23:15
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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
mattst88 wrote:

By the way, Don't tell me to go somewhere else when you're using my code, dumbass.


Funny, i thought i stated that it was based on nocona's code... Whether you're nocona and changed name, i don't care. I rewrote the whole thing from scratch using nocona's code only for example. It was even more heavily made from the pdf that was included in the archive. Actually, quite honestly, i only really used nocona's code for the shared object examples. The linux64 examples were also slightly helpful. Sorry if i didn't make that clear enough. If you made that code nocona used, then i guess a thank you is in order, but i doubt you made the pdf, as i didn't get it from here (I should probably find the link on the web again since i lost it, as if it might be polite to thank them too).
Post 07 Aug 2008, 05:02
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comrade



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 1137
Location: Russian Federation
comrade
kohlrak wrote:
What of my facts isn't straight?


How about this one:
kohlrak wrote:
Linux was better written than windows, hands down, so if you're just out to criticize me and my work with linux go somewhere else


I am not here to argue that Windows is better written than Linux. I am more curious how you arrived to that conclusion? For starters, define "better written". But more obvious is the question where you got Windows source code to even begin making that comparison.

I don't want to turn this into a flame-war, and I really hesitated replying to this post in the first place. I will just "go somewhere else" now.

_________________
comrade (comrade64@live.com; http://comrade.ownz.com/)
Post 07 Aug 2008, 05:38
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comrade



Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 1137
Location: Russian Federation
comrade
Someone delete this thread... its really negative and ugly. Not just kohlrak, but everyone's reaction too.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 18:00
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LocoDelAssembly
Your code has a bug


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 4633
Location: Argentina
LocoDelAssembly
I had dreamed it or there was a kohlrak's post here talking about the apparent superiority of Linux security and lower vulnerabilities rate compared to Windows? I'm also remember myself writing a response to that but without pressing the Submit button because I found it useless.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 18:25
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kohlrak



Joined: 21 Jul 2006
Posts: 1421
Location: Uncle Sam's Pad
kohlrak
This whole place is just as "negative and ugly." I'm just clearing up a few loose ends and i'm done with this damn facade of a helpful community. My last how many posts, despite how true, have been condemned. Most of my posts throughout my stay have been condemned, either i'm that right or they're that wrong. Kinda funny, i post a fact and get a very hostile reply saying that it's insignificant. I provide possible solutions in other posts, get condemned. i think i was right a long time ago when i said that the heap would leave the heap. One of the people being the most rediculous (aside from myself if you see it that way) is f0dder, who i argued with quite alot in the heap about topics such as religion. But i agree, delete this post. I'd do it myself, but i can't as people replied to it.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 18:32
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LocoDelAssembly
Your code has a bug


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 4633
Location: Argentina
LocoDelAssembly
Since you have deleted all your work this thread does not belong here anymore so I'll move it to Heap just in case that extra debate is needed, later I'll delete it.

Next time I suggest you don't give a shit on opinions or at least not to the extreme to erase all of your post just because 3 or 4 over a few thousand members disliked your work.

Additionally further investigation would be good, for example by finding alternatives to ld (the tool that it is doing the real "mess"), or trying to remove the "junk" with command line arguments or even finding a more aggressive alternative than the strip command.

And finally, if there is not good enough alternatives to ld then it would be great to create one, and for my personal taste I would like very much one that does not needs the "dev" objects which sometimes it is a pain to get (for example trying to get the i386 devs other than libc on an AMD64 distro like Ubuntu or Debian).

PS: I would like very much if you can reconstruct your posts or at least the first one so this can be moved back to Linux.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 18:53
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f0dder



Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 3170
Location: Denmark
f0dder
Deleting all your posts? How childish Smile

Look, kohlrak, out in the real world, people have differing opinions - and it often gets a lot more messy than it is here. A word of advice: try backing up statements with facts, and don't blow tiny little things out of proportions.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 22:10
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LocoDelAssembly
Your code has a bug


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 4633
Location: Argentina
LocoDelAssembly
Damn, he is editing every post with "No more giving back..." Confused ( http://board.flatassembler.net/search.php?search_author=kohlrak )

Please stop doing that, not only it is pointless but you are harming the forum also.

If you are so committed to leave the forum (an over-reaction IMHO), then do it, but I think there is no need to degrade the readability of every thread you have participated.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 23:22
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f0dder



Joined: 19 Feb 2004
Posts: 3170
Location: Denmark
f0dder
Long live nightly forum backups + user ban Smile

Really, somebody should integrate version-control with forum software, that'd be cool.
Post 07 Aug 2008, 23:27
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
Oh my, that's what I call hurt ego. Look kohlrak, you posted your opinion, people disagreed, got harsh, ... so? Get over it and carry on.

And stop editing your old posts, or we will have to disable your account!
Post 08 Aug 2008, 00:05
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