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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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revolution
HyperVista: Taking your thoughts one step further - why even light the LED at all? Perhaps we should all just go to sleep at dusk and awaken at dawn thus eliminating the need for the LED (or any artificial lighting). What about all the processes involved in making the LED, should we also consider what effect the LED factories have?
Post 14 Jul 2008, 14:23
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shoorick



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
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shoorick
some such systems are similar to one i saw once in "inventor-rationalizer" magazine


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Post 14 Jul 2008, 14:32
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MHajduk



Joined: 30 Mar 2006
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MHajduk
shoorick

Your picture is funny but, unfortunately, completely inadequate as a comment to the physical problem stated by sleepsleep.

We have to change potential energy of the lifted bottle to the electricity, not electricity to the electricity (through many stages) as you have drawn. Wink
Post 14 Jul 2008, 15:10
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shoorick



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
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shoorick
i have draw it "as was" Smile
Post 15 Jul 2008, 07:51
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
k, i think the you guys focus too much on the goal. (to light up the LED), i put it there as an example only.

to be straight, how much energy, power, steady current could be harvest by lifting a 1liter bottle of water or etc at above ground 1 meter?

Quote:

you expend in raising the bottle (adding kenetic and potential enegy to that bottle) was derived from the food and minerals you intake, which is converted to caloric energy, which is burned by your muscles. all well and good. but it should be understood that we are not creating energy by lifting that bottle.

yah, i understood.
and if lifting this bottle maybe 3 hours per time but could light up the whole house. (i think it is possible) just we don't harnest the energy efficiently.
Post 15 Jul 2008, 14:32
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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revolution
sleepsleep wrote:
to be straight, how much energy, power, steady current could be harvest by lifting a 1liter bottle of water or etc at above ground 1 meter?
This is basic high school physics.

P(E)=mgh (in joules)

m=mass in kg
g=9.8 ms-2
h=height in metres

1 litre of water weighs ~1kg

I'll let you do the calculation.
Post 15 Jul 2008, 14:41
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Artlav



Joined: 23 Dec 2004
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Artlav
sleepsleep wrote:
to be straight, how much energy, power, steady current could be harvest by lifting a 1liter bottle of water or etc at above ground 1 meter?

What is the power consumption of a bright LED?
If we take it as 25mA and 1.5V, then 1kg/1m is only enough for 4.5 minutes of light with 100% efficiency potential energy to electricity transformation.
Post 15 Jul 2008, 14:53
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edfed



Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 4238
Location: 2018
edfed
i tried to light a single led using 6 leds as solar cells.

but it is not enough.

without any load, the leds can generate 9 volts. 1,5 volts / led
but when i load it, the voltage fall under 1.5 volts.
not enough to light one led.

to start to bright:
a red led need 2,2 volts @15mA
a green one need 2,3 volts @15mA
a yellow one need 2,4 volts @15mA
a blue one need 2,5 volts @15mA

all values are average, depend on the technology, the manufacturer and the size of the led.

then, let see the experience:

6 led exposed to direct sun light, generate 9,39volts without load.
first constation:
the voltage increase slowly when loading the circuit.
Code:


    voltage     load    current

    9.45V       open      0A
    0V          short     12µA
    0.0126V     1k        12µA
    0.126V      10k       12µA
    1.26V       100k      12µA
    9.45V       1MO       9.45µA
                                        
    


then, calculate how many leds are needed to obtain 2.4V @15mA


edit:

after 1h45 of exposure to the sunset it have charged a 220µF capacitor @ 7.44Volts.

i will plug it under the day light tomorrow on a 10000µF.

if only 6 leds can recharge a capacitor, it is possible to make some "electronic phosphorescence".
Post 15 Jul 2008, 17:59
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Loser



Joined: 12 Jun 2008
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Loser
tom tobias wrote:
... floating in paradise with 79 virgins ...
In the other thread, you said there are 17 virgins, but, now, in this thread, it became 79. So, exactly how many virgins are we talking about? Rolling Eyes
Post 16 Jul 2008, 03:25
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shoorick



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
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shoorick
virgins (and other) - megawatts of lost power:

Image

a LOT of LEDs could be lit
Post 17 Jul 2008, 09:48
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tom tobias



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tom tobias
What some folks fail to recognize is the amount of HEAT given off by all these fat people, including me, of course. I wish someone who still remembers how to convert calories to joules could compute the quantity of heat released to the atmosphere, annually by 6 billion earthlings, versus 1 billion, from a century ago....Skeptics of "global warming", please take note.
Isn't it amazing that no one has yet devised an elliptical trainer that would harness the energy, and convert it to something useful, even if only powering the room lights or televisions which they are watching....
Confused
Post 17 Jul 2008, 10:29
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edfed



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edfed
human being consume too much energy.
let's save the energy, it will reduce all the problems.
that's all.
Post 17 Jul 2008, 10:40
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
would the volmeter shows current under such situation?
since the hot from water A will love to get into the water B through the wire?


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Post 29 Jan 2009, 10:24
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
sleepsleep: I don't know the answer but I would like to read your results later after you have tried it.

BTW: Where is your return path for the electrons?
Post 29 Jan 2009, 10:29
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YONG



Joined: 16 Mar 2005
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YONG
Are you talking about a thermocouple? Rolling Eyes Wink
Post 29 Jan 2009, 11:17
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tom tobias



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tom tobias
I acknowledge being confused, in general, and further befuddled in particular by this diagram. It almost looks like an illustration of the Peltier effect, but not quite, and also, reminds me somewhat of Lord Kelvin's observation one hundred fifty years ago, regarding heat transfer along a wire with a temperature gradient at the two termini. Problem, as I see it, is that voltmeter interrupting the wire....Hmm.
Post 29 Jan 2009, 11:51
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
k, let me explain a bit regarding this thought.
yeah, forget about all those that you know first, just imagine thinking from a lone guy on earth who just discover something and so on.

first, for sure, when the water get heats up or a direct sunshine to the copper that maybe link with a wire, for sure, the wire will gets higher temperature too.

so, something is moving there. the heat is passing from atom inside the object to another atom.

so, could we trap this kinetic motion to work for us? coz electricity (in my simple sense) is = moving electron, if there is moving electron, we will get electricity.

so, the cold water will also spread it coolness through anything object that attached and capable to transfer the cold.

if cold mets the hot let assume on a single wire ... wat actually happened? assume in a tug war, that use steel compare to rope, both side keep pushing into center. (so, some kinda big energy must be around the center).

so, how to make this practical to produce energy that could do our shit jobs???
Post 29 Jan 2009, 14:35
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
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revolution
Electricity is electrons moving from one place to another. Heat is atoms vibrating against other atoms. They are two separate mechanisms.

When electrons move you need a loop to complete the circuit. An ideal voltmeter does not allow electrons to flow through it but may allow heat to propagate through it. Do you see the different words used, electrons flow, heat propagates. Different transfer mechanisms are at work.
Post 29 Jan 2009, 14:45
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Borsuc



Joined: 29 Dec 2005
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Borsuc
Quote:
We will have solar energy as soon as the utility companies solve one technical problem -- how to run a sunbeam through a meter.
Wink
Post 29 Jan 2009, 19:07
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