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vid 19 May 2008, 14:20
Learn assembler to understand how x86 works. Also learn C before learning C++. C++ is pretty complex and complicated language, and I'd say you need to understand assembly to really understand C++.
Knowing ASM is quite a must-have, but very hard to find job for. C/Asm combination is easier to find good job, espcially if you dig deeper into ASM stuff. With C++ you shouldn't have problems to find job. |
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19 May 2008, 14:20 |
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Someone 19 May 2008, 14:26
Na. I dislike the idea to work as programmer. Its a hobby for me and should stay like that. Its more like sense. Does it make sense to learn FASM? Why FASM and not another ASM Language? What makes FASM special?
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19 May 2008, 14:26 |
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dap 19 May 2008, 14:55
I'd suggest ASM or Python (or another simple and powerful language which would help you learning algorithms).
vid wrote: Also learn C before learning C++. This is a bad idea, the two langages are really different and when learning C++ he will have to "unlearn" all the procedural habits he got when learning C. Someone wrote: Does it make sense to learn FASM? Why FASM and not another ASM Language? What makes FASM special? Once you know the x86 ASM language you can quite easily move to another x86 assembler anyway, so just pick one and don't worry about it. To me the main advantage of FASM is that it has very powerful preprocessing habilities. Commercial assemblers like MASM and TASM aren't the best choice because they aren't updated anymore. NASM has a syntax similar to FASM, it's more widespread but it's less powerful. There are also GoASM, HLA, Gas, ... |
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19 May 2008, 14:55 |
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vid 19 May 2008, 15:00
Quote: This is a bad idea, the two langages are really different C++ is multiparadigm, it can be procedural language as well as OOP language. Also, i support "from low level" approach to OOP, as outlined in my (uncompleted) article. Quote: and when learning C++ he will have to "unlearn" all the procedural habits he got when learning C. I'd say you should learn another habits, and learn when to use which. There is no need to forgot old stuff, just to learn new stuff properly, and use each when more applicable. Quote: Once you know the x86 ASM language you can quite easily move to another x86 assembler anyway, so just pick one and don't worry about it. To me the main advantage of FASM is that it has very powerful preprocessing habilities. Commercial assemblers like MASM and TASM aren't the best choice because they aren't updated anymore. NASM has a syntax similar to FASM, it's more widespread but it's less powerful. There are also GoASM, HLA, Gas, ... I'd suggest either FASM, NASM, or YASM, because their syntax is the most logical one. MASM/TASM/GoAsm try to emulate HLL too much and cause lot of confusion and ambiguity. gas has very old easy-to-parse hard-to-write syntax. And HLA syntax... oh well  |
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19 May 2008, 15:00 |
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rCX 19 May 2008, 15:18
Quote:
yes 
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There are several free and open source assemblers, including FASM, NASM and YASM. NASM is more likely to be used with a high level language, while FASM is more likely to be used in to make programs completely in asm. YASM is a fairly new rewrite of NASM. I converted from NASM to FASM because of it's active community. I can't speak for MASM or TASM because I have not tried them yet. Although this is old it still has useful information: http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/AsmTools/WhichAsm.html |
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19 May 2008, 15:18 |
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Someone 19 May 2008, 15:18
I guess Ill stick to FASM. You seem to be very happy with your decision. Lets say I want to code an MP3 player. By just selecting a file and it will play it. Is that very hard with FASM? Cus in VB it was easy as hell. And which tutorial / way to learn would you suggest?
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19 May 2008, 15:18 |
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edfed 19 May 2008, 15:26
Quote:
and very yes as the community have a serious amount of code and arcticles now Quote:
the syntax. the simplicity. the asm orientation. func op1, op2 fasm input file output file that's all. Quote: fasm or cpp? fasm, because cpp and c are too much used by too much coders, and if you want a place were to be original and have a serious value, code in (f)asm. less than 1% of coders are assembly experts, then, assembly coders are rare, then, expensive... |
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19 May 2008, 15:26 |
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asmhack 19 May 2008, 15:41
Someone wrote: I guess Ill stick to FASM. You seem to be very happy with your decision. Lets say I want to code an MP3 player. By just selecting a file and it will play it. Is that very hard with FASM? Cus in VB it was easy as hell. And which tutorial / way to learn would you suggest? stick with fasm, at the begining it will be a little hard but after it will be fine and enjoing
as for the second question, in vb it is hard as hell to make a mp3 player (decoder, apu) unless you just call a library that will play.the.file.for.you in asm you can do that also as easy as hell using win api calls or other libraries |
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19 May 2008, 15:41 |
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Someone 19 May 2008, 15:45
Oh sorry. Yeah your right. I meant that with my question. DLL / WinApi usage. So its not that hard? Any tutorial / guide suggestion or how to start?
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19 May 2008, 15:45 |
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LocoDelAssembly 19 May 2008, 15:55
Post the part of the Very Bullshit, err, sorry, the Visual BASIC code that plays the file so we can see which API it could be using.
[edit]As for tutorials on API use, check the examples inside the fasm Windows package and http://flatassembler.net/docs.php?article=win32 . And if possible check the manual of mandatory read of fasm to get familiar with it  [/edit] |
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19 May 2008, 15:55 |
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Someone 19 May 2008, 17:51
Nothing agains BASIC pls. Its a nice language for everyone whos interested in coding windowed applications as primari.
Here's the very easy way by using the Windows Media Player Control: http://msdn.microsoft.com/de-de/library/bb979468.aspx //Even though its mainly used to click your application together very fast withouth knowing whats happening. Thats why I would like to migrate to something lower. Like ASM or C++. |
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19 May 2008, 17:51 |
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edfed 19 May 2008, 17:58
there is still a very good program that uses MP3 playback API on this board.
http://board.flatassembler.net/topic.php?t=5086 TO mods: one very good thing will be to put it in example page. or is it possible for me to make a topic for all achieved and serious projects made with fasm? posting the attachments or posting the link to the thread? |
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19 May 2008, 17:58 |
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asmhack 19 May 2008, 21:05
Someone wrote: Oh sorry. Yeah your right. I meant that with my question. DLL / WinApi usage. So its not that hard? Any tutorial / guide suggestion or how to start? well don't be scared of assembly language, it's not so hard at all.. you can call libraries very easy like in vb for example: Code: push 0 push address_of_string_1 push address_of_string_2 push 0 call [MessageBoxA] ;or the easy way with macro: invoke MessageBoxA,0,push address_of_string_1,push address_of_string_2,0 the return is always in the eax register as i say the best way to learn is the practice.. after that you can look at examples and read some documentations |
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19 May 2008, 21:05 |
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vid 19 May 2008, 21:15
absolutely no need to be scared... things will be *much* more scary if you try to learn C++ without understanding assembly
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19 May 2008, 21:15 |
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ic2 21 May 2008, 23:28
Don't mean to be so dramatic but to Someone here is my 2 bits and I don't know any other way to speak ... I am new to FASM and I came from MASM. Never got deep like I should be by now. Anyway, I learned most of every basic thing by playing with examples. Breaking them down and building them back up while playing attention to everything i did... asking questions and receiving responses no matter how stupid my question was. People will help. So don't get mad by the way they respond. They think you already know most basic things. If not just let him know or try again.
Now I am into FASM. And I say, it is wonderful because you have source and can go deeper and deeper on your own as you learn. Two people I know of came from being experts in MASM has now been with FASM for years and they love it ... I MEAN TRUE MASM LOVERS EXPERTS,KINGSssssssssss. Most people think MS$ way is the only way. It is not. Most of their products is design to hide stuff from the programmer. ASM people taught me to be no fool. I say first learn ASM (Masm32 and all of FASM is a must) Now I'm in school and force to learn some kind of C with-in the next two years ... Hell, I plan to go Java if I got to waste my time. Thank to vid link it will not be a waste in my mind while in class... Everything I see I'll think vid OOP's in pure assembler, FOREVER. And Thank GOD or who ever is above for Tomasz Grysztar. He did us all a favor and still at it ... This is no play toy. Please don't stop your continuance based on feedback vid. People can't see the forest for the trees overnight. A thread like that lives forever. PLEASEeeee... |
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21 May 2008, 23:28 |
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vid 21 May 2008, 23:42
Thanks for kind words... no need to over-drama it though
Also, that article isn't the best way for learning assembly. It's meant to learn OOP *after* you know ASM (or C). |
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21 May 2008, 23:42 |
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ic2 22 May 2008, 02:13
I give myself a C to a B- in basic understanding of assembler. If I study your OOP assembler style would that give me an edge when I be force to take (C++) ... but in Java which I read that it is the modern day (most used) C++ style.
If the answer is yes than I will make an easy A after understanding OPP in FASM during my first summer vacation for practice to generale a better I deal of what's really happening even in C++ or Java. I must have an A. I'm going into Information Security Technology and I want to be far ahead of the game. I don't know nothing but assembler and want to think assembler in every thing I do and if it's not possible I refuse to waste my time with it and search for another career that I can apply this kind knowledge to. Anyway, I think I am on track and your pages will be a wonderful place to start. I just give credit where credit is due and let you know we do care. Your pages got right to the point and I think I see the light already. C++ Text Books would never tell me that (MS got to sell a product) and ff so it be years latter. |
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22 May 2008, 02:13 |
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rugxulo 24 May 2008, 21:06
Someone wrote: Hello everyone who is around here! If you're familiar with BASIC but want more power, try FreeBASIC. It's multi-OS (DOS, Win32, Linux, etc.), inline asm, plus you can use FASM to write external modules and link 'em to your main project. It's very powerful but nice forum and FBHELP is quite helpful too. You can even link C++ stuff to it if you want (although even more FB-native OOP features are coming soon). |
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24 May 2008, 21:06 |
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Someone 25 May 2008, 14:38
Thank you all!
I just started reading some theorie about ASM. |
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25 May 2008, 14:38 |
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