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Index > Heap > § 202c StGb - The Nightmare of all Network Administrators


What do you think about it?
I don't like it.
77%
 77%  [ 7 ]
I don't know.
11%
 11%  [ 1 ]
I like it.
11%
 11%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 9

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lehox



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 16
lehox
Well the §202c is probably a nightmare for all German Network Adminstrators.
§202c says things like:

1. If somebody buys, developes, sells or distributes tools which could be used for criminal things in any way will be put into the jail or he must pay money.

These TOOLS are actually tools an admin needs.
For Example Nessus, NMAP, Aircrack-ptw(for testing WEP-Encrypted Networks), Service Scanners etc.

Well NMAP is a very often used tool..

Well what do you think about it?
Post 05 Sep 2007, 16:10
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Chewy509



Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Posts: 297
Location: Bris-vegas, Australia
Chewy509
Poor analogy...

Does that mean a knife shop that sells knives, be liable as well? I mean I could buy a knife, then use that knife to kill someone (a criminal act), can the owner of the knife store be jailed?
Post 05 Sep 2007, 23:37
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Plue



Joined: 15 Dec 2005
Posts: 151
Plue
How about cars? Very often used by bank robbers.
How about paper? Can be used for blackmailing.
How about network cables? Can be used for strangling.
Post 06 Sep 2007, 11:34
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DOS386



Joined: 08 Dec 2006
Posts: 1901
DOS386
> If somebody buys, developes, sells or distributes tools which could be used for criminal things in any way

OK. Let's buy some rolls of loo-paper and make fire ... the "developer" gets hanged, the supermarket chief gets hanged, ... well maybe me too ... but what moron cares Very Happy
Post 06 Sep 2007, 21:55
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chaoscode



Joined: 21 Nov 2006
Posts: 64
chaoscode
well,
the german law says, that tool which are used to prepare or do Cyber-criminal acts are forbidden.
the problem is, that there is no exact definition what is allowed, and what not, so that IT security experts could get arrested, when the german goverment doesent like them)
(where ends Security and where starts prepare a hacking attack)

but the german "Bundstrojaner" (a trojan from german Goverment that should hack/open/observer Computers from maybe terrorists) by self is so an forbidden program...
but the Firewall and/or AV (rookrevealer and so on) will block it....
or u just disconnect from internet, when u do terroristical things^^
Post 06 Sep 2007, 22:55
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lehox



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 16
lehox
Well but what about privacy? The German Government is recording Internet Traffic, Analysing Phone Calls and other Traffic... Well as an Administrator I have to say such tools as I mentioned above are required to keep a network secure and functional. As the Government defined §202 now even some Unix and Linux Distributions seem to be "illegal" tools because a lot of distributions include such tools as Dsniff etc.
So what to do?

Something about the Government Trojan (Der Bundestrojaner) - Also known Remote Forensic Tool:

The Government wants to use their trojan to get access to the machines.. But why can they use an illegal tool to get access to machines?
Post 11 Sep 2007, 08:10
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
what's that Bundestrojaner? You say gov has written it's own trojan "for safety of nation"?

I am sick of this let's-all-be-afraid-of-terrorism crap.
Post 11 Sep 2007, 13:45
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MazeGen



Joined: 06 Oct 2003
Posts: 975
Location: Czechoslovakia
MazeGen
vid wrote:
what's that Bundestrojaner?

Some info (in Czech):
http://aktualne.centrum.cz/zahranici/evropa/clanek.phtml?id=496258
Post 11 Sep 2007, 17:39
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HyperVista



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 691
Location: Virginia, USA
HyperVista
vid wrote:
what's that Bundestrojaner?

Some info (in English Very Happy ):
http://www.mercurynews.com/business/ci_6770364

something fun Laughing
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ChiKy16F9ag
Post 11 Sep 2007, 19:15
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lehox



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 16
lehox
great one Hypervista Smile
Post 12 Sep 2007, 12:34
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Furby



Joined: 01 May 2007
Posts: 74
Location: Kraków, Poland
Furby
huh I'm a programmer not satan/nessus user Razz
Post 15 Sep 2007, 09:32
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lehox



Joined: 06 Aug 2007
Posts: 16
lehox
satan?
Post 15 Sep 2007, 19:48
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HyperVista



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 691
Location: Virginia, USA
HyperVista
Post 15 Sep 2007, 20:35
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madmatt



Joined: 07 Oct 2003
Posts: 1045
Location: Michigan, USA
madmatt
what a name.
Post 15 Sep 2007, 22:35
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DustWolf



Joined: 26 Jan 2006
Posts: 373
Location: Ljubljana, Slovenia
DustWolf
Furby wrote:
huh I'm a programmer not satan/nessus user Razz


No matter! We can still bitch about the governments decisions. Wink
Post 17 Sep 2007, 08:30
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