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MichaelH



Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 402
MichaelH
Ummmm Vid, Niels was not talking nonsense when he mentioned -

Niels wrote:

For ASM, we can split it in 2:
- Preprocessor conditional assembly
- Processor conditional assembly

For C that would be:
- Pre-C-generator conditional c-flat-source
- C-Generator conditional (method-)assembly


He is in fact 100 percent correct. It's been a long time since I was in C\C++ but I believe you can set Visual C++ (not sure about other compilers) to output a Pre-C-generator conditional c-flat-source file in the project settings.
Post 01 Aug 2007, 21:58
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
MichaelH: at least, he has very interesting naming of things.

Calling something "preprocessor conditional assembly"? Well, preprocessing is one stage, and assembling is another in FASM. He failed to realize that "preprocessor" in FASM is name for very specific part, and what he gave as example was both assembly time conditionals and preprocessor conditionals.

He compared it to "processor conditional assembly". I absolutely don't understand how it falls into topic, as f0dder clearly explained he means conditional compilation of parts of code. Also I don't understand from what point of view you can "split" any aspect of ASM just to these two unreleated things.

"Pre-C-generator"... what is "C-generator" anyway? Only think i can think of as "C-generator" is some kind of utility that generates C code from something else (and google agrees with me). What is "Pre-C-generator" then? I doubt he was talking about this kind of C generator.

This is what he said about C generator:
Quote:
C-generators solve C-source-questions to assembly in compiler used methods to do so; You could say 'predefined (glue/break-)solutions'.
There we are again... I did quite some C coding, but i don't have a tiny idea what "C-source-question" or "c-flat-source" should be. And that sentence doesn't give absolutely any sense to me, even not gramatically (this can be attributed to weak english, but still).

Even if he really meant something useful with that, with the way how he presented it, it IS nonsense. Maybe it's just problem of his english skill, and lack of knowledge of FASM (so that he failed to realize that topic is on conditional preprocessing vs. conditional assembling).
Post 01 Aug 2007, 22:43
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MichaelH



Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 402
MichaelH
Quote:

There we are again... I did quite some C coding, but i don't have a tiny idea what "C-source-question" or "c-flat-source" should be.


Well I don't want to get in the way of a good old biffo between two fellow forum members but if you go investigate the project setting in visual C++ I mentioned, perhaps you'll understand that the "c-flat-source" term Niels used is in fact perfectly understandable.
Post 01 Aug 2007, 23:22
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
Quote:
Well I don't want to get in the way of a good old biffo between two fellow forum members but if you go investigate the project setting in visual C++ I mentioned, perhaps you'll understand that the "c-flat-source" term Niels used is in fact perfectly understandable.

I have been using Visual C++ IDE for some time too (fortunately not anymore), and I don't recall anything like that. Anyway, i browsed through all options there again, but couldn't find even the word "flat" in those options.

Maybe you could tell me which option has something to do with "C-flat-source", and what exactly is "C-generator"?
Post 02 Aug 2007, 09:27
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MichaelH



Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 402
MichaelH
I assume you're using Visual C++ Express. Goto -

project properties\C/C++\Preprocess\Generate Preprocessed File

Visual C++ will then produce a big flat file with all the included files in one file. If that's not the same or very close to doing the same as fasm's preprocessor (PREPROCE.INC) then I don't know what is.
Post 02 Aug 2007, 11:04
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
I have visual studio 2005, it's there to. Yes, it is same as FASM preprocessor is doing.

But calling that "Pre-C-generator conditional c-flat-source"? I bet he is first one to use terms "C-generator" and "c-flat-source" for this. Also consider (syntactically wrong) examples he gave for this one. Example he gave for this was demonstrating run-time condition based on compile-time constant.

If you think that is "100% correct", could you rewrite for me (using standard terms) his following 2 "splittings" of ASM and C? So that i know what exactly was meant by which. Ideally, add some syntactically proper examples.
Quote:
For ASM, we can split it in 2:
- Preprocessor conditional assembly
- Processor conditional assembly

For C that would be:
- Pre-C-generator conditional c-flat-source
- C-Generator conditional (method-)assembly


I REALLY have no idea what he meant by those, and i believe neither did he. And those examples with some unclear pseudo-syntax that he gave made me confident that he doesn't know what he is talking about.
Post 02 Aug 2007, 11:20
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Niels



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 255
Niels
vid wrote:
Also


The 'Also' part has no fundament.

vid wrote:
consider (syntactically wrong) examples he gave for this one.


The understanding relies on common basics of languages in general, not wrong but easy to understand.

vid wrote:
Ideally, add some syntactically proper examples.


It is the 'syntact'-reason I used general basic.

vid wrote:
Example he gave for this was demonstrating run-time condition based on compile-time constant.


You are the one, mixing-up the pre- at runtime's, not me.

vid wrote:
I REALLY have no idea what he meant by those, and i believe neither did he.


I guess you just like the shite in your eyes so much.

Niels
Post 02 Aug 2007, 16:19
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MichaelH



Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 402
MichaelH
Quote:

If you think that is "100% correct", could you rewrite for me (using standard terms) his following 2 "splittings" of ASM and C? So that i know what exactly was meant by which. Ideally, add some syntactically proper examples.



No sorry, I'm just a bit afraid that what I write may not be acceptable, will be split to another thread and I will suffer the wroth of our leader Wink

I'm not opposed to you deleting/moving posts as you feel. I just wanted to make you aware of something you may have been overlooking..... now cloves up, the round 2 bell is about to ring Smile
Post 02 Aug 2007, 21:26
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vid
Verbosity in development


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Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
MichaelH: I don't see this as a fight between us two. There is no point in it. I wouldn't split that thread just because he posted nonsense. Many people here (including me sometimes) do it, and still there is no "deleting" (and maybe should be)...

I moved those posts mainly because of his lame attack on Loco, after Loco wrote that his post is nonsense. Posting false quotes to make someone appear stupid... that is simply too much to take, and has no place in this board - i hope you agree. That original post was moved because it was part of "battle" between them, and had no place in that thread either.

You can feel free to try to convice me that it did had sense, i have no reason nor right to "opress" you because of that. In fact, I would welcome any try to bring some light into that custom terminology he used.... So my request is still valid: please explain what those 4 things are, in standard terms and standard syntax.
Post 02 Aug 2007, 22:41
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MichaelH



Joined: 03 May 2005
Posts: 402
MichaelH
Quote:

MichaelH: I don't see this as a fight between us two.


I was referring to the battle between you and Niels...... as I said, delete/move as you feel fit, especially those annoying "God is light" etc crap one liners Niels and others post here.
Post 02 Aug 2007, 23:13
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LocoDelAssembly
Your code has a bug


Joined: 06 May 2005
Posts: 4633
Location: Argentina
LocoDelAssembly
I wonder why Neils is becoming so santified now...

The mess was started thanks to me so, can all of you stop blaming vid, please?

I believe that even removing "only has sense this" frase from my post he would started his show anyway because he is trying to leave people like stupid everytime you tell something to him. Take your time to see the "ADC rax, imm32" thread here (and from the beginning), where he has no idea of what he is talking about and he ends the thread in this way
Neils wrote:

sekigun wrote:
ADC RAX,0x1234 should be translated to ADC RAX(not r64),imm32 and it is.




No Sekigun, "ADC RAX,0x1234" should make an error and "ADC RAX,dword 0x1234" should be fine.
r64 means 64-bit register, so, RAX will do...


sekigun wrote:
The problem is you cannot enforce the encoding because of the operand size mismatch error.




I hope you see the light soon Smile

Niels


Disrespectful as ignorant in the subject.... I mean, is it so hard to test in fasm that the code in fact works? He shoots first and the worst of all is that he even don't ask later, just shoots and at a very fast rate (double, triple, quad, ..., posts in a row)

I'm apologize to the forum members for opening the pandora box but I still beleave what I said because it didn't fit well in the original context (apart of what vid says).

And the misquoting, I think he quoted me that way because he thinks that all layers are the same, proving again that from his last circus acting of the past year he didn't read the manual or not understood it.

And, BTW, no one see here that he has not much intentions to help anybody? If he want to put me like an idiot it would be better to prove it instead of starting contentless posts that only proves his insulting abilities.

Well, lets see how many posts from him we have earned for tomorrow for keep talking about this....
Post 02 Aug 2007, 23:44
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Niels



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 255
Niels
LocoDelAssembly,

Besides your ignorance and the remarks that come forth with it:

YOU referred to an other topic:
- The 'intelligent-size-solver' is not 'what I am not seeing'


Niels

ps.
FYI
I work 'with the book' Wink
Post 03 Aug 2007, 10:34
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Niels



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 255
Niels
LocoDelAssembly wrote:
I still believe what I said because it didn't fit well in the original context (apart of what vid says).


I responded at an already playing side-topic, the rest is still there.

Niels

ps.
I 'misquoted' your 'quote'. Wink

ps2.
Vid agreed with you, like you agreed with Vid.
Post 03 Aug 2007, 11:01
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Niels



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 255
Niels
MichaelH wrote:
"God is light" etc crap one liners Niels and others post here.


I heard two computer-applications talking to each other, the second program said to the first: "I don't believe a processor exists, I think it's all crap." and the first answered the second: "Would a game-engine exist without a player?", "When the processor is there and you don't believe it, would that matter for you or Him?"

Smile Smile Smile
Post 03 Aug 2007, 11:21
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Niels



Joined: 17 Sep 2006
Posts: 255
Niels
I do understand the wrong ((human-)historical-) god-perspective...
A Holy One in the New Testament wrote:"If I had to write all GOD does in a book, the world would be too small, too soon..."

Most 'christians' (still) think that, that Holy One would write one-liners like:
- 'GOD is death'
- 'GOD is gone'
- 'Where is the GOD, that I can give my commands to Him?'
-: Real crap
jmp -
Post 03 Aug 2007, 11:28
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