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Platone



Joined: 09 Jun 2005
Posts: 6
Platone
Why do I use Fasm instead of Nasm?
In other word...what are the advantages of fasm?


Tnk
Post 17 Jun 2005, 09:46
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YONG



Joined: 16 Mar 2005
Posts: 8000
Location: 22° 15' N | 114° 10' E
YONG
Take a look at this article:

http://flatassembler.net/docs.php?article=design
- Design Principles or why flat assembler is different?

YONG
Post 17 Jun 2005, 10:00
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decard



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1092
Location: Poland
decard
Basically because fasm can do everything that nasm can, and it has a lot of additional features.
More: fasm is faster, it supports more OSes, it is in constant developement... etc etc Wink
Post 17 Jun 2005, 12:58
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HyperVista



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 691
Location: Virginia, USA
HyperVista
Yong - great article! Thanks for the link.

Below is a link to another good article by Randall Hyde on the topic of which assembler is best. He says a lot of nice things about FASM.

http://webster.cs.ucr.edu/AsmTools/WhichAsm.html

Quote from article:

Quote:
The FASM assembler has generated a lot of interest recently as the "heir-apparent" to NASM. FASM is much faster than NASM (FASM is written in assembly, NASM in C) and FASM generates much better object code than NASM because it automatically optimizes displacements (e.g., jumps). FASM also provides the ability to produce executable files in a single step, without using a linker, that further speeds up the development process. As this is being written, there is considerable activity centered around FASM in various newsgroups and on the Win32Asm community board. FASM is syntactically similar to NASM, so conversion from NASM to FASM is very simple. As such, FASM is siphoning off a lot of NASM users who are dissatisfied with the progress being made on the NASM assembler (new releases of NASM are few and far inbetween). Though FASM has fewer features than NASM, FASM's development is continuing and many programmers see FASM as NASM's ultimate successor.
Post 17 Jun 2005, 13:58
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
Quote:
HLL support: very limited via macros

I think Randall should update this. If I recall right, then this is from 2002 or so, and FASM is evolving very quckly.


Last edited by vid on 18 Jun 2005, 07:58; edited 1 time in total
Post 17 Jun 2005, 14:11
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decard



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1092
Location: Poland
decard
Randy was asked to do so long time ago (a few times I think Wink), but he refused to do so (because of lack of time). I would call it ignorance: look at alt.lang.asm - he has a lot of time for writing when he is arguing with Betov. This article should be updated, because people reading it could think that fasm is still very simple has limited features...
Post 17 Jun 2005, 14:16
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THEWizardGenius



Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 382
Location: California, USA
THEWizardGenius
Yeah, FASM isn't a hobby-assembler anymore; it's a great open source assembler availible on many different platforms, with a huge user-base and a great programmer behind the entire project (that's Privalov) who takes time to talk to his users and help them. And it has plenty of HLL-like features, such that people have even implemented OOP-like constructs, and BASIC-like macros! Ralph should change his page!

BTW, I first found at about FASM at one of Ralph's pages, and it was the only assembler I liked. I didn't approve of TASM or MASM since I first read about trhem, and NASM was slow and unwieldy, but FASM had good syntax and the commandline options were few and simple. Who wants to type "tasm /r/v/g/a/s/d/o/p/z thing.asm thing.obj" and then "tlink /a/f/h/j/d/v/b/h/t thing.obj thing.exe"? OK, I'm exaggerating a bit, but still...

Anyways, FASM rocks!
Post 17 Jun 2005, 16:29
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YONG



Joined: 16 Mar 2005
Posts: 8000
Location: 22° 15' N | 114° 10' E
YONG
Btw, did you know that Randall Hyde is indeed a member of this forum:

http://board.flatassembler.net/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=315

Perhaps, we should PM him demanding an update of his article! Laughing

YONG
Post 18 Jun 2005, 04:08
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coconut



Joined: 02 Apr 2004
Posts: 326
Location: usa
coconut
he is strongly in favor of his "HLA" thing.. i started reading his art of assembly book, but he has so engrossed himself in the idea that HLA is the future of the world that the book is almost unreadable and useless. there is no assembler out there that has a feature that cant be easily and cleanly implemented in fasm
Post 18 Jun 2005, 21:07
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UCM



Joined: 25 Feb 2005
Posts: 285
Location: Canada
UCM
What's with this guy and HLA? I don't see anything that's so amazzingly good about it. He seems to want everybody in the world to use HLA. Randall probably doesn't want to change it because he wants to advertise HLA.

EDIT:
everybodys thoughts wrote:

Randall Hyde invented HLA

stupid me

_________________
This calls for... Ultra CRUNCHY Man!
Ta da!! *crunch*


Last edited by UCM on 25 Jun 2005, 00:39; edited 1 time in total
Post 18 Jun 2005, 21:37
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THEWizardGenius



Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 382
Location: California, USA
THEWizardGenius
There are two great things: HLL's and ASM. People who only like HLL's will not care about assembler enough to try HLA. People who only like assembler will not care enough about HLL's to try HLA. People who like both usually don't try HLA, because HLA isn't all that great. Randall Hyde is kinda weird, in that respect.
Post 23 Jun 2005, 01:38
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pelaillo
Missing in inaction


Joined: 19 Jun 2003
Posts: 878
Location: Colombia
pelaillo
Randall Hyde wrote HLA to help his students to get into assembly without pain, because he considered that they need a transition language between assembly and their background on HLLs.

IMHO this add an extra layer between the HLL and the assembly way of thinking: effectively writing assembly code.

The difference between asm and HLLs is more than the syntax and language elements, is the real interaction with the physical thing: playing in the machine field and this need a different mindset. There is no interchangeability asm<=>HLL. They are complemental for a programmer.

Randall Hyde had spent several years in crafting his tool and this has driven out his objectiveness. The sad thing is that he feels himself under attack if someone comment out his product.
Post 23 Jun 2005, 14:35
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coconut



Joined: 02 Apr 2004
Posts: 326
Location: usa
coconut
exactly
Post 23 Jun 2005, 22:57
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HyperVista



Joined: 18 Apr 2005
Posts: 691
Location: Virginia, USA
HyperVista
@platone - I hope you found the answer to your question about which assembler (FASM or NASM) is best.

I almost regret bringing Mr. Hyde into the dialog. Although he wrote, albeit some time ago, about some of the limitations of FASM (at the time), he did go on to say some very nice things about FASM. We can speculate as to his lack of motivation to update his website, but in the final analysis it's just speculation. I think the fact he wrote some very positive things about FASM despite the fact he has his own assembler to "promote" speaks volumes about his objectivity.

I think we're all in agreement that FASM is really the best assembler going!

- Hypervista
Post 25 Jun 2005, 03:00
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Kain



Joined: 26 Oct 2003
Posts: 108
Kain
Randall compares the assemblers based on the most popular ones that are in use, usually, they are all compared to MASM/TASM in terms of professional vs. hobby level.

For example, when he writes, "HLL support: very limited via macros", it is still true as FASM does not have built-in HLL support, it is limited to macros, whereas others such as MASM, TASM and HLA have HLL support built in. Perhaps with the most recent updates to FASM, he should drop the "very" part and if that bothers anyone, feel free to write him an e-mail requesting a change next time he updates the site.
Post 25 Jun 2005, 22:08
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coconut



Joined: 02 Apr 2004
Posts: 326
Location: usa
coconut
the HLL features are included in the fasmw package for optional use. its not like we have to write our own macros for IF/THEN, etc
Post 25 Jun 2005, 23:00
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decard



Joined: 11 Sep 2003
Posts: 1092
Location: Poland
decard
I wouldn't call it "very limited by macros". Current preprocessor can allow quite complex HLL structures. Anyway whole document is old and a lot of his statements are untrue now.
Post 26 Jun 2005, 06:13
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Tora OS



Joined: 30 Jun 2005
Posts: 2
Location: California
Tora OS
Well Ive been using NASM, but i think im going to give FASM a try...it seems to sound better than NASM.
Post 30 Jun 2005, 05:23
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YONG



Joined: 16 Mar 2005
Posts: 8000
Location: 22° 15' N | 114° 10' E
YONG
Quote:

Well Ive been using NASM, but i think im going to give FASM a try...

Excellent decision!

YONG
Post 30 Jun 2005, 07:00
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vid
Verbosity in development


Joined: 05 Sep 2003
Posts: 7105
Location: Slovakia
vid
by the way - another fact for NASM:
There are lot of people here (almost everyone) who migrated from
TASM/MASM/NASM to FASM. But do you know ANYBODY who migrated from FASM to othe assembler?
Post 30 Jun 2005, 07:31
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