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Index > Heap > Ron Paul - Economic Collapse is Happening!

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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
Apr 29, 2015
Ron Paul speaks out! Economic Collapse is Happening Now! Protect Yourself!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HdI8aD53C3A

Jan 1, 2016
Ron Paul Warns of Dollar Collapse 100% In 19 Feb 2016
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEEoqKUc3bQ
Post 31 Jan 2016, 17:01
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
Do you have any comment about it? Do you think it is correct or false? Is this warning or a humorous post?
Post 01 Feb 2016, 04:18
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
revolution wrote:

Do you have any comment about it?

like a monopoly pc game, one player "A" use hack to change amount of his dollar variable, and he uses this hack every time he needs more money to buy or pay something.

like world scenarios, there are few big players who draft lots of rules and stuffs for those small players, like monopoly inside monopoly.

please refer to your website for remaining stories.

revolution wrote:
Do you think it is correct or false?

they are playing chess with high stake,
like driving a petrol based car without filling it, hack the fuel gauge to make it shows (F),
it works, it moves, but one day it will stops moving.

revolution wrote:
Is this warning or a humorous post?

the game continue and players keep finding ways to pro long the music,
soon, one by one is going to left without a chair.
Post 01 Feb 2016, 07:52
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Tyler



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Tyler
sleepsleep, if you're interested in learning more of the economic theories of Ron Paul, you should read Henry Hazlitt's Economics in One Lesson. You can get it in HTML, PDF, or audio here.

Personally, I am pretty convinced of the validity of Austrian economics, but in the interest of integrity, I should mention that it isn't very highly thought of in academia. And he *really* shouldn't be giving specific dates like that. It is just not possible to predict things with the accuracy he seems to think he can. Bullshit predictions like his really hurt the credibility of Austrian economics. It's not even possible to say with certainty that any of this will come to fruition in the next 5 or 10 years(!), let alone next month.
Post 01 Feb 2016, 18:49
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AsmGuru62



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AsmGuru62
@Tyler:
Wise words.
Didn't we hear the dollar collapsing "news" at the end of 2014?
The target year was 2015 for USD to "collapse".
Post 01 Feb 2016, 20:21
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
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Tyler
AsmGuru62, you do have to understand we are in very unchartered territory. Austrian theory predicts that artificially lowering the interest rate leads to artificial expansion (misallocation of resources) which must be supported by increasing amounts of cheap money as the misallocation compounds. An Austrian would point to the dot com bubble and housing bubble as examples of what can be caused by an artificially low interest rate. But this isn't a sustainable strategy; Austrian theory predicts it must either end and allow a recession to clear the misallocation or end with hyperinflation.

The scary part is that, relative to the period since '08, the interest rate before then was high. In the US, we've been at 0-0.25% for the last 6 or so years. Before now, I don't think we'd ever been to 0% before. And it's not just the US. Sweden, Switzerland, and Japan have already went *negative*; something the world has never seen before. By their (non-Austrian theory) these low interest rates are supposed to spur growth and fix the problems, yet here we are 6 years later still needing unprecedentedly low rates.

I think this should make it clear why Austrians are alarmed. It's clearly a highly unusual circumstance, even non-Austrians can't help but admit that when objectively looking at the numbers. What's more alarming is that the people in charge (nom-Astrians) *are* trying to deny the peculiarity of the circumstances we've found ourselves in and are trying to act as if it's business as usual for a recovery to take as long as this one has. The US Federal Reserve recently baked themselves into a corner and had to raise the interest rate to preserve faith in the market (high rates = market is doing well, so leaving them low signals that the FED doesn't think the market is doing well). So what did they do? They raised it by the lowest amount possible, to a level still lower than almost any period in history, just to save face and backup their talk.

Anyway, sorry for the wall of text. Just trying to explain what's so unusual that these guys are making such strong predictions. They shouldn't do so with such precision, granted, but they do have at least some reason to claim we're headed somewhere *really* bad, IMO.
Post 01 Feb 2016, 23:14
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AsmGuru62



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AsmGuru62
Very interesting!
Thanks!
I got to take a look at that link you posted.
Post 02 Feb 2016, 02:21
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
just to clarify, dr. ron paul doesn't makes any exact date prediction, the date was put by youtuber, i copy paste the youtube title and link.

if available or implemented economy theories work, maybe we will have less monetary issues compare to now.

i foresee global one currency.
the best would be open source digital crypto non-mining currency.

digital coin given to every registered human each month instead of mining and wasting all the resources.

bonus for non-used coin every month,

smart people just need to figure out how to create abundant, abundant of food, clothes, place to stay, transportation.

everything will and should be free if human want to progress into more advance civilization.

the whole money is about trust,
and we just need to let everybody have this coin for free and start using it.
Post 03 Feb 2016, 15:38
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Tyler



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Tyler
sleepsleep wrote:
just to clarify, dr. ron paul doesn't makes any exact date prediction, the date was put by youtuber, i copy paste the youtube title and link.
I thought that was too ignorant for Ron Paul, but I was at work and couldn't watch the video.

sleepsleep wrote:
if available or implemented economy theories work, maybe we will have less monetary issues compare to now.

i foresee global one currency.
the best would be open source digital crypto non-mining currency.

digital coin given to every registered human each month instead of mining and wasting all the resources.

bonus for non-used coin every month,
That would not work. Currency needs to represent the valued stored in it. A coin given freely doesn't represent stored value. Without it being a store of value, it is not as useful as other coins which do represent stored value. So people won't use it. If you were a producer of value, would you accept something you know someone got for free for the produce of your labor?

sleepsleep wrote:
smart people just need to figure out how to create abundant, abundant of food, clothes, place to stay, transportation.

everything will and should be free if human want to progress into more advance civilization.
The advancement of civilization is not only dependent on knowledge, but also on having the physical chain of production built up to produce the items of our imagination. Without physical productive capability, knowledge is useless. Imagine if you could tell CPU engineers every detail about our modern CPUs. It wouldn't change history very much because they wouldn't have a small enough process to produce them and they would still have to use the tick-tock until they could produce small enough transistors to replicate our processors. The tick-tock is more dependent on iteratively shrinking their production machinery than it is on knowledge. Or imagine if you could tell a caveman everything about how to build a car. That knowledge would be *completely* useless.

Capitalism maximizes the accumulation and efficient usage of production machinery. Give people an un-manipulated money which accurately represents value stored and fulfills the other requirements for a currency, provide them with security in their private property, and you will see growth like in western countries or in Hong Kong/South Korea/Japan*, Look at the food production in the US. We don't starve anymore; we die from eating too much. Why? Because food is insanely cheap. Why? Because we've built up the production chain required to produce food very far. Why? Because the incentives are aligned in such a way as to promote such development.

The problem in other countries is the very notion you subscribe to. They think things should be given free without any respect to the productive contribution of the recipient. This implies that there is an obligation on the part of others -- others who are more productive -- to provide for those who are less productive. This further implies that it is okay to take from some who have built more to give to others who have built less (or none). This idea disincentivizes outside investors (such as people from the US) from coming to those countries and building production chains and makes it such that the country must build them on their own, which is slower than it otherwise would be. Outside countries had a large influence in the current first-world status of those Asian nations by investing in them; if they had not invested, they would be like all other Asian nations. The key is to incentivize investment by assuring investors that you won't steal their productive capabilities. The won't build anything in those countries until they know that it won't be stolen when the local government decides it'd like to take it to give to local citizens. **

*: I put a star by Japan because they are notorious for fucking their currency up. All countries do it, but they do it more than almost anyone.

**: There are a host of other issues, but this is a big one. It's the main reason no one outsiders want to build anything of value in most of South American (which I know specifically from studying their situation) and a, I'm assuming from general knowledge, also why Asian nations aren't growing as fast as they could in theory. I'm guessing, essentially, that it is leftover socialist/collectivist sentiment.
Post 03 Feb 2016, 17:39
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
Tyler wrote:
Currency needs to represent the valued stored in it.

i tend to see it in the following ways,
- perceived values, expected values, human just need to perceive them as of values, they don't necessary need values, eg. based on scarce gold. (btw, bank will screw this by creating paper gold and etc)

Tyler wrote:
A coin given freely doesn't represent stored value.

- a coin that give freely to every human on earth every month, open source, no more money injection ponzi scheme by some limited or elite parties will have following values, humanity, honesty, justice,

- the amount of free coin given every month is enough to let that human have food, clothes, shelter and paying transportation cost.

- every human get the same coin, this eliminate poverty totally.

- current world economy is working exactly like master and slave,

- it works when everybody getting and using it, the coin is mean to make transaction possible (because human love to put some integer to show the value of something and do comparison), he got free coin, but you got free coin too, everybody got same amount of free coin too, how that is not fair?

- like playing game, eg. coc clash of clan, some players likes highest score, highest townhall, make into championship but some players purposely stray in lower league, they are not interested in hoarding all coins.

Tyler wrote:
would you accept something you know someone got for free for the produce of your labor?

- if i create a video, post it into youtube, only captured 500 views.
- if i create a song, recorded it, post it into youtube, 200 views.
- i wrote in this board, no reply, 10 views, then it gets to bottom then next page.

would you give free talk to an event if there are fifthly thousand human eagerly to listen to what in your mind?

would you help, donate your blood if someone urgently need some of your blood?

Tyler wrote:
The advancement of civilization is not only dependent on knowledge,

the advancement of civilization from my pov is the ability to move on, to solve current issues, problems forever, totally, and move on to next problems.

whether to solve, or to move on, we need ideas, imaginations.
i expect more and more, abundant of ideas, imaginations, new knowledge, come from human, human who got enough food, clothes, shelter, and ability to travel from one place to another at his or her own pleasure.

knowledge is wealth, is like a gigantic treasure box, some never open this box, most open and don't bother, there are like infinite stuffs inside this box, but only human who lucky to get their basic needs fulfilled able to explore this box.

why we keep on dealing with broken design and replace it with same old design?
because this is obviously where the companies could profit, grow big and keep on enslave everybody.

Tyler wrote:
Give people an un-manipulated money

such un-manipulated money wouldn't exists if money are created by government, it must be open source.

Tyler wrote:
We don't starve anymore; we die from eating too much.

but they are enslaved 24x7, 9 to 5, like walking zombie, they are living but they are dead.

the honest question, if they are promised to receive some amount of money every month, enough cover their life expenses and maybe a 5% saving, would that improve their life, would they have another view on what kind of life they want to have?

Tyler wrote:
Because the incentives are aligned in such a way as to promote such development.

i tend to see society moving into kickstarter or other crowd fund, crowd sourced projects,
the traditional way is, the big man on top enslave every person he needed to create, continue, perpetual his businesses.

the businesses hardly solve human issues, because they realized they will be out of business after they solve it totally and permanently.

Tyler wrote:
others who are more productive -- to provide for those who are less productive

you got a water filtered connected machine, some one ask for a glass of water.
the issue is rich getting richer and poor getting poorer.
rich guy bought hybrid car, save petrol, use electricity,
rich guy bought solar panels, less bill,

it is not the poor guy don't want to buy car that save petrol,
poor guy want solar panels too and stop paying his bill.

but current economy of supply and demand only allow rich people to get best of everything, food, clothes, shelter and transportation.
i think poor guy want to fuck nice and pretty models too, but, too bad, they are only allowed watch it from whatevervideostreaming.com website.

over all feelings we deal with is fear,
fear dominated almost everything in our every day life. nearly 100%.

as long as we human have the pyramid mentality, i step you to go up, someone else step me to go further up,
i see no way human could advance.
Post 03 Feb 2016, 19:36
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
Anything given freely has no value. If you give everyone free money/coins/whatever then inflation will skyrocket and the currency becomes worthless. Also, if everyone got everything provided for free then who are the providers? Why work when everything is free? And with no one working then no food is produced so everyone starves. You can't create money from nothing because it has no value and is worthless. Money has to represent payment/reward for work done. You can't escape the requirement for work else the population starves to death. You can replace money with other things like cows/chickens/corn/etc and go back to a barter society but that would be a massive backward step that would send us back to the stone age.
Post 04 Feb 2016, 02:52
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
revolution wrote:

inflation will skyrocket

inflation happened due to collapse of people confidence about that particular currency, infinite factors, eg war, politic, corruption in money supply, unpaid debt, default and etc, happened because of sudden spike in one of the factor above,

the above idea give projected input of new money supply, no inflation will happen,
there are ways to prevent also, all coin transfer will be charged 1%,
system will top up any account that doesn't have 1k every month.
system make sure each human got at least 1k every month.
free money given by system to each account will come from 1% and if not enough, new coin will be created.

limit max human account to 20k.
extra money send to 20k account will be directed to system account.

the scenario will plays out like how telco give 30GB quota limit to users,
at first, users will try very serious to use up all 30GB every month,
later, users will only use whatever that require and don't care if they didn't use up all 30GB quota.

human can create business account, all account in/out are transparent, available to view by everyone anytime.

business account limitation according to how many human and coin funded inside,

revolution wrote:

who are the providers?

system main job is to automate entire human requirements,
providers will exists,
open source softwares is one of the best example, to migrate the concept from software to everything else.

revolution wrote:

You can't create money from nothing because it has no value and is worthless

actually, you can,
sleepsleep wrote:

- a coin that give freely to every human on earth every month, open source, no more money injection ponzi scheme by some limited or elite parties will have following values, humanity, honesty, justice,

once earth human realise the humanity, honesty and justice value, they will prefer to deal in this coin rather than other corrupted currencies which keep on enslave them.

money itself has no value,
it is a medium to make transactions possible due to human nature.
it becomes money because supply party accepted it.
it becomes money too because supply party are forced to accept it. (military, politic, threat, nuclear, etc)

human walk in to fill in the blank when the blank requires them, when they see the blank and realise they need to fill in the blank.


Last edited by sleepsleep on 04 Feb 2016, 17:19; edited 1 time in total
Post 04 Feb 2016, 17:07
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


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revolution
You can pretend to create money by increasing the number in everyone's bank accounts, but you don't increase value that way. You only end up creating terrible inflation. With no "work" behind the money people get, then having money proves nothing about how you contribute to society. If everyone gets money for nothing then the money itself is worth nothing, and thus you end up with no money because no one will value it and they ignore it.

sleepsleep, perhaps I can suggest you read a different source for economics theory. You appear to have a weird idea about the purpose of money and how it gets its value.
Post 04 Feb 2016, 17:17
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
why the coin value need to increase or decrease?
if we really need to based that coin value to something (so that to have a guide on position game price on stuffs), i would choose flour.
1 coin will equal 1 kilo of flour forever.

- is there enough jobs for all human to work and earn a decent living now, and near future?
- what is the prospect for future jobs availability? higher or lower? consider advancement of robotic and AI
- if everybody move to urban areas, what would happen to rural areas? and what would happen to urban areas.

money is like a pen
value is like words, ideas, how to, formed, combined, joined using this pen,
giving everybody a pen to write is humanity
teach everybody basic words to express their thoughts is humanity,

we wish everybody could contribute to society,
but what kind of contribution we could get if this guy who wish to contribute, live in a sad or pariah state? always worry of no enough food, clothes, no place to sleep, hardly travel from one place to another?

internet become internet "because everybody use it, develop it, share it",

this theory?
Richest 62 people as wealthy as half of world's population
400 richest people control more wealth than every country on Earth except the U.S., China and Japan
http://inequality.org/99to1/facts-figures/
1% of earth population control 50% of global wealth?
Post 04 Feb 2016, 21:24
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Tyler



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Tyler
We've already tried tying paper currency to a physical commodity and then printing more money than there was physical commodity to back it. It was called "the gold standard." What happened was that people just hoarded gold. Again, what is produced is the only thing that matters. Just look at it and it's really simple that this can't work. How can a money fix any problems related to scarcity? Scarcity is the problem. The problem is that we don't have enough resources available for everyone to be rich. Printing money doesn't magically create more resources.

And yes, inequality is bad. But inflationary schemes like you're proposing are what cause inequality. http://www.iea.org.uk/blog/how-monetary-inflation-increases-inequality

If we would get rid of inflation, we could end the unnatural force for inequality and the inequality that would remain would be solely due to inequality in productivity.
Post 05 Feb 2016, 20:20
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/eric-holt-gimenez/world-hunger_b_1463429.html
Quote:
Hunger is caused by poverty and inequality, not scarcity. For the past two decades, the rate of global food production has increased faster than the rate of global population growth. The world already produces more than 1 ½ times enough food to feed everyone on the planet. That's enough to feed 10 billion people


Tyler wrote:

The problem is that we don't have enough resources available for everyone to be rich.

The problem is that we(banks ,governments, elites etc oppressors) don't want to easily let everyone to be rich and live a life.

[1] human are easily command, manipulated, controlled, slaved when they are poor, when they always have no enough of basic necessities and everything.

Tyler wrote:

If we would get rid of inflation,

inflation or deflation is a designed problems from the beginning,
what do they expect when they pegged the coin value based on commodity value(price)?

1 coin will equal 1 kilo of flour forever.
this will solve inflation or deflation. forever.

people can hoard gold, but people cannot hoard flour,

people can keep lots of gold without others complain, but people cannot keep lots of flour without others start complaining.

gold last forever, flour last maybe a year or 2,

gold easy to store big amount in small size, flour don't seem so,

Tyler wrote:

we could end the unnatural force for inequality

inequality will exists and i think it is natural, since there are infinite ways that allow human to perceive something, anything, what human could do is to minimize the gap and provide basics for human to live a life.

we start by limit how poor a human could live on earth.

inequality is when only banks, government could create money out of thin air,
it is more practical and ethical for system to top up non 1k account for each human every month.

the idea that only banks, government could create money out of thin air is so nefariously plain in sight. the reason is [1]
Post 05 Feb 2016, 23:47
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
i could summarize the current financial issue,
2 The rich get richer and the poor get poorer

they became so rich to the level they could buy, threat, corrupt and influence government in setting its policies.

nothing wrong with 2 because they are the exact expected output of capitalism.

it is exactly like monopoly, i let you figure out how the richest player let the game continuously run even if he already bought all shops and build hotel.

The 10 Richest Corporations on Earth
http://www.therichest.com/business/companies-business/the-10-richest-corporations-on-earth/?view=all

they can buy any slave, any human, you, me, any company, any country at anytime they want.
Post 06 Feb 2016, 00:22
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
2 The rich get richer and the poor get poorer

above scenario happened because:

- assume in a close money supply society with every person having equal amount of money from the beginning.

rich guy money = rich guy money + poor guy money

- assume in a banks create new money supply through giving loans to poor human society, every person having equal amount of money from the beginning.

rich guy money = rich guy money + poor guy money

rich guy figure out how to control bank,

rich guy control bank, government and influence anything regarding to new money supply,

rich guy = rich guy money + new money supply loan + all the money owed by poor human


so, how to solve this problem?
Post 06 Feb 2016, 00:45
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
The Money Masters - Full Documentary (1996)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B4wU9ZnAKAw
Post 11 Feb 2016, 20:12
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Tyler



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Tyler
You assume that loans are not beneficial to the person who receives the loan. This is false. Why else would they want the loan? For them to want it, they must see it as the best option available.

And no, in real-wage (amount you can buy per unit of labor) terms, the poor absolutely don't get poorer. (And trade is not a zero sum game. Both sides of a trade benefit.) Very much the opposite. If you prefer videos, then watch this: https://youtu.be/S7Qf0ey-pOo
Post 12 Feb 2016, 01:40
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