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typedef



Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 2913
Location: 0x77760000
typedef
I don't think this is about FASM at all. This is about Assembly, specifically for Intel. It seems you don't know how to...
Post 28 Jun 2015, 02:13
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PeExecutable



Joined: 26 Jun 2015
Posts: 181
PeExecutable
I'm not going into a religious debate with you, this thread is a fasm newbie thread with questions about fasm, if I only could get these religious conservative trolls out of the thread it would become constructive. Listen, there are people who want to move forward, and we don't want to move backward, we don't want to participate in your temples where you worship old and ancient objects. We want to move forward, including the author of FASM. Forward we go. That means, we're leaving you behind. We're basically dumping you into the ocean, so that FASM can continue to evolve. Are you getting it. You are outdated, along with your very oldfashional friends and lunatics. Laughing

The author of FASM is too young to be stuck with an old idea, he too wants to move forward, but you are keeping him stuck. He is too young to be stuck, his mind is too brilliant to be stuck, he wants to use his mind, not let it rot at one particular position in his life. We want to evolve, not stay behind. Please respect that. Now I don't have anything particular against you conservative people, other than that you're unable to adapt anymore.

It smells of elderberries and Tomasz want a fresh future.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 02:49
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fasmnewbie



Joined: 01 Mar 2011
Posts: 553
fasmnewbie
Quote:
this thread is a fasm newbie thread


Hey, that's me!

Quote:
if I only could get these religious conservative trolls out of the thread it would become constructive.

That's not me. Revolution is. Don't listen to him.

Quote:
Listen, there are people who want to move forward, and we don't want to move backward,


FASM is the most advanced x86 assembler in the world with unmatched Macro Language system.

Quote:
we don't want to participate in your temples where you worship old and ancient objects.


Now that's me and my guru in Tibet. I am offended. I am reporting you to my guru.

Quote:
We want to move forward, including the author of FASM. Forward we go. That means, we're leaving you behind.


FASM versions is numbered forward and upwards. I don't recall FASM releases numbered backward.

Quote:
We're basically dumping you into the ocean, so that FASM can continue to evolve. Are you getting it. You are outdated, along with your very oldfashional friends and lunatics. We want to evolve, not stay behind. Please respect that. Now I don't have anything particular against you conservative people, other than that you're unable to adapt anymore.


Just like I said, FASM is the leading and most advanced x86 assembler in the world. The most active assembly forum in the whole W W W. You can't prove otherwise.

Quote:
It smells of elderberries and Tomasz want a fresh future.

F-ASM stands for Forward and Future.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 06:20
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fasmnewbie



Joined: 01 Mar 2011
Posts: 553
fasmnewbie
PeExecutable wrote:
But listen carefully to what I have to say about this, take it seriously. "If you let the macro system take over everything with the assembler, people will stop appreciating macros and they will lose respect of it".

People will get respect for the macro system, when they can use it in small things.

A powerful macro assembler, and a loveable macro assembler is one the user can use without the actual need to use macros, in that way, macros become a luxury.


I thought you are the biggest fans of PROC, __float__ and ".if" macros. You just can't program without them, can you? You worship NASM's __float__ macro like no other in the other thread while saying that FASM is bad because it doesn't offer that "genius" __float__ macro. And now you are the one opposing the use of them?

It seems like you are contradicting your own tail.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 06:40
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 17249
Location: In your JS exploiting you and your system
revolution
PeExecutable wrote:
I read through the list builder, I understand the concept. You basically take over the charge of defining the sections from inside your own macros, and thereby you can also control the order of defined data. It's smart and I like it.

But apart from that, if we go back to a fasm-point of view, the goal of a macro engine of an assembler (in my opinion), is to make it powerful and flexible, but once you need a macro to strongly override the default behavior of an assembler, time has come for standardization.
The reason those macros exist is because fasm can generate an EXE file directly. If one is using a linker then it is the linker's job to rearrange and merge things.

If you need it, fasm still supports the "standard" sequence of assembling and then linking. In that situation you don't need those macros to merge sections together.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 07:16
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 17249
Location: In your JS exploiting you and your system
revolution
Tomasz Grysztar wrote:
You could use "LABEL ... AT ..." construct for this purpose, in fact the only difference between numeric symbols defined with LABEL and = is that the former cannot be redefined.
For integers this works well. For floats it struggles.
Quote:
flat assembler version 1.71.39 (3145344 kilobytes memory)
label x at 1.0
error: invalid value.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 08:56
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Tomasz Grysztar
Assembly Artist


Joined: 16 Jun 2003
Posts: 7715
Location: Kraków, Poland
Tomasz Grysztar
revolution wrote:
For integers this works well. For floats it struggles.
Yes, the floats are a separate type of values and fasm does not have an option to define symbols of such type (it has been in plans for fasm g, though). The "=" operator has an additional feature of converting other types of values into numeric value of specified size - by default it converts floating point value as if "qword" operator was specified (this conversion is gone in case of fasm g - but there "=" allows to define symbols of other types than a numeric [linear polynomial], like string values, and in future perhaps floats).
Post 28 Jun 2015, 09:15
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typedef



Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 2913
Location: 0x77760000
typedef
PeExecutable wrote:
I'm not going into a religious debate with you, this thread is a fasm newbie thread with questions about fasm, if I only could get these religious conservative trolls out of the thread it would become constructive. Listen, there are people who want to move forward, and we don't want to move backward, we don't want to participate in your temples where you worship old and ancient objects. We want to move forward, including the author of FASM. Forward we go. That means, we're leaving you behind. We're basically dumping you into the ocean, so that FASM can continue to evolve. Are you getting it. You are outdated, along with your very oldfashional friends and lunatics. Laughing

The author of FASM is too young to be stuck with an old idea, he too wants to move forward, but you are keeping him stuck. He is too young to be stuck, his mind is too brilliant to be stuck, he wants to use his mind, not let it rot at one particular position in his life. We want to evolve, not stay behind. Please respect that. Now I don't have anything particular against you conservative people, other than that you're unable to adapt anymore.

It smells of elderberries and Tomasz want a fresh future.

What do you really want? Either you are a narcissist and want to force Tomasz into doing something you want or you are just here to speak foul of FASM.

It seems like you know FASM already because you're requesting changes...and yet you are a new bie. And I'm neither conservative nor liberal. I'm just an endangered heterosexual male now that the whole country is turning to rear deliveries and rainbows. Oh, and how was the pride March?
Post 28 Jun 2015, 10:51
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AsmGuru62



Joined: 28 Jan 2004
Posts: 1408
Location: Toronto, Canada
AsmGuru62
"rear deliveries" - lmao!
You made my day! Rainy day, I might add.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 11:39
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PeExecutable



Joined: 26 Jun 2015
Posts: 181
PeExecutable
typedef wrote:

It seems like you know FASM already because you're requesting changes...


Yes I know fasm already, I mentioned that I already know fasm, masm, tasm, nasm and yasm. I have used all of them, not extensively, some of them I've been using frequently. I have a pretty good comparison of them, enough to know which one I should be settling for and which to use. I know the weknessess, some of them are rather ugly. I absolutely love NASM, but that doesn't mean I absolutely hate a different assembler. But there are some very nasty things in NASM that I just can't live with. Yasm solves those problems, but there are some thing in Yasm that I just can't live with too.
typedef wrote:

and yet you are a new bie. And I'm neither conservative nor liberal. I'm just an endangered heterosexual male now that the whole country is turning to rear deliveries and rainbows. Oh, and how was the pride March?

I don't know what to say.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 12:47
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PeExecutable



Joined: 26 Jun 2015
Posts: 181
PeExecutable
revolution wrote:
The reason those macros exist is because fasm can generate an EXE file directly. If one is using a linker then it is the linker's job to rearrange and merge things.

If you need it, fasm still supports the "standard" sequence of assembling and then linking. In that situation you don't need those macros to merge sections together.


Ok, well I pretty much only code in coffee mode, I don't use fasm for linking purposes. I use a separate linker, polink (and polib, porc)

But I absolutely adore the extended features, size optimizations and the cleanliness of fasm, and want to use fasm as a coffee production facility.

The only thing I really need to know, is this:

1. I need to know exactly what include files I need to put in my coffee source files to be able to use extended features, without getting all the extra "noise" in the source file I don't need, in order to produce coffee.

2. A way to easily construct data in any section I want from anywhere and from within my macros. I quite often define global data from my macros.

There is really not much more than that. The rest I will take gradually from there. So far, you've given me a lot of information about it.
Post 28 Jun 2015, 12:53
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PeExecutable



Joined: 26 Jun 2015
Posts: 181
PeExecutable
I managed to get ccall to work but not cinvoke, an example of using cinvoke would be appreciated. I wonder why I even ask that question I have watched many examples already, but my code still don't work and I don't have the source file here so I can't paste the code. And I wonder about the differences between _label TCHAR 'some text',0 and _label du 'Some text',0 (I think the latter forces unicode and the former doesn't force it?)
Post 04 Jul 2015, 00:54
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