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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
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sleepsleep
you know,
this struck me after i watch that 2 hours venus project london 2009 talks, linked by bitRAKE,

and i question myself,

what have i did to drive this world, this earth into better place?

what have i contribute overall to a better world, better society, better system, better humankind, ..... etc.

it seems, i really must, need to ask myself sincerely,
what have i done? except writings, try to convey my ideas, what else have i done?

and how about you?
Post 23 Aug 2013, 15:51
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nyrtzi



Joined: 08 Jul 2006
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nyrtzi
I try to be nice to people and to help them. Wouldn't the world be a better place if everyone did the same?
Post 23 Aug 2013, 18:00
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matefkr



Joined: 02 Sep 2007
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matefkr
this is a good questoin : Đ i have given some food for ants, they liked it. just go up to chocklet and sugar and eat it. cute things. they dont have to look for it for ages. this had some temporary effect. Sometimes they would get in my way and i would communicate to them and would grab them one by one (gently.. very gently i have good finger gentlenesss), and then i relocated them to their comrades. sometimes i have also pushed them a little bit. but i also gave some noises (wich i "felt" so they would take some directions compared to their moving direction).

i did some small thigns occasionally to help another realy small ones. there was actually a long lasting one wich is pretty cool (i guess long lasting, but girls lie). a girl who was told to me by another girl She was a rape victim, and i traveld with Her once, and She fell asleep. i remember there was another rapevictim writing she has squeezing or grinding teeth before falling asleep. i have seen it. so She was sleeping eventually, She girnded teeth, i thought She has bad dream, so i woke Her up. then later once more, so i started insteada to very gnetly storke the naked skin on her arm. the breathing became more calm/slower, and the grinding stoped. etc etc. Later She orgasmed. while dreaming i think, and i think unfortunatley or what, She squirted (i think). On the other hand, She told me befor travel that She has no boys who love, But later, i found on Her facebook that later (after this) She had company.. some boys.. so i guess its cool.. perhaps fixed some level of hatered towards boys.

I have masturbate not so long ago (another reason), so perhaps this is a reason why i cant remember anything else long lasting done by me to help others (although i can be wrong.. because there were never direct links estabilished, mabe someone else also something or whatever).

Basicly i did nothing. only small temprary acts.. and not many at all. I talked my uncle to take meds.. but .. there is link there with a childhood fake trouble (trouble faked by somone else but in the same home, not same family).
well i have otherwise two hands two legs some eyes and ears, but only one phallus, and i am uggly, so i cant do much. plus no control over robots etc.. so ..

i wrote a couple of advises but it doesnt count i guess.
nothing realy wich i could confirm longlasting.
Post 23 Aug 2013, 18:22
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matefkr



Joined: 02 Sep 2007
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matefkr
yeah, guess so, if the everyone would be nice and try to help the world would be a better place.
Post 23 Aug 2013, 18:23
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bitRAKE



Joined: 21 Jul 2003
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bitRAKE
Me too, that is always at the forefront of my actions - does this contribute to the betterment of the world?

I wonder if there is a way to connect all these ideas. To create a holistic model. It can't be a rigid model, but it need to be sufficient to eliminate the paralysis which conflicting competing ideas generate. Perspectives seem to have a domain of validity - dependence on a value system, and resource availability.

Maybe something like this already exists? Jacque Fresco (Venus Project) was unable to collect logistic information on world resources due to economic fears. I wonder what other limitations exist to engineering the future?

What would such an information resource look like? Engineering ideas can be created as a "black box" sort of thing - compiled of text, audio, video, 3D models, code, etc. Each idea will specify utility, dependencies, and be open to peer review. It will be based on specifics and not a place for faith based notions.

As the dependencies of each "black box" are modeled, a larger model is created until it is a reality and better courses of action become obvious. (Or, maybe that's just a hope of mine.)

[Specific projects have pages, but the efforts are so disconnected it seems.]
Post 23 Aug 2013, 18:26
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
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sleepsleep
nyrtzi wrote:
I try to be nice to people and to help them. Wouldn't the world be a better place if everyone did the same?


i agree with you,
but i am aware that i am kinda choosy, and i dont understand why,
i suppose this kinda effect is coded inside DNA, i got no proof, but i suspect.

it just kinda impossible to treat everybody equally, treat them nice,
the best i could do is neutral, it is not nice, and no hatred, just neutral.

some people just make you feel so sick,
the way they talk,
the way they sound,
the way they present their body language,
the way they act,
the way they smell,
and etc.

neutral state when encounter with certain group of people would propagate to some kinda of dislike, it is not hate, but dislike.

idk if like / dislike a random person is shaped by culture, religion, or etc observable factors.
like i said, i suspect this is coded inside everybody DNA.
Post 23 Aug 2013, 19:17
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
try and error, i guess that is the only workable method for us, everybody, to proceed into a better society.

and in the end, after everybody try so hard for years, to persuade everybody to treat each other nice, and you still see raping, war, oppression, bully, government, big corporations to force others become slaves, killing, more killing ..... etc

one day, one wake up and realize, maybe they all should just be let dying through whatever means,

one realize, they dont deserve, they simply just dont fucking deserve...

ah, we are doing all these "better society, better system, better earth, better humanity and etc positive values" all with GREAT AND HUGE EXPECTATION

i try to be realistic, and be true in conveying what i feel, since, conversation without sincerity to solve, truth, will lead nowhere.
Post 23 Aug 2013, 19:46
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bitRAKE



Joined: 21 Jul 2003
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bitRAKE
sleepsleep wrote:
i suspect this is coded inside everybody DNA.
http://www.zeitgeistmovingforward.com/

The first 30 minutes covers misconceptions about DNA, and suggest the early environment is a much more likely cause.

_________________
¯\(°_o)/¯ unlicense.org
Post 23 Aug 2013, 22:46
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nyrtzi



Joined: 08 Jul 2006
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nyrtzi
sleepsleep wrote:

but i am aware that i am kinda choosy, and i dont understand why,
i suppose this kinda effect is coded inside DNA, i got no proof, but i suspect.

it just kinda impossible to treat everybody equally, treat them nice,
the best i could do is neutral, it is not nice, and no hatred, just neutral.


True. I think that this is not a rational thing but more like an instinct. We are instinctively afraid of things that we feel that can threaten us. For example in some societies people are now persecuting gay people probably simply because they fear that which they don't understand. However the thing that is supposed to make us humans better than animals is that we can choose to follow reason instead of instinct.

Then again I'd say that the same thing applies to ethics and morality. The obligation to do the right thing isn't something people should do only if and when they feel like it but because it's the right and sensible thing to do. Being good to people to make the world a better place isn't something that can be based on feelings alone.

But yes, being fair and neutral is basically a part of being good to people. I'm referring to the definition of what being nice to other people is in practise. Being nice to people takes up energy and we don't have an infinite amount of it. It is true that probably no one can like everyone without distinction. However you don't need to like people to treat them with respect, fairness and equality.

Of course there are people who make this really difficult by not doing so themselves but fighting fire with fire is not really a solution at all. The only real solution is (even thought it is absurdly difficult) for good to win over evil by goodness which changes people for the better. However making sacrifices for the good of everyone is not the same as becoming everyones' doormat.

If you look at the people who want to kill, rape, enslave, etc. others there is a pattern there. It looks almost as if these selfish people are just doing whatever their instincts say it takes to survive. Of course no one does. We all die sooner or later and sooner or later and even our memory is forgotten. So if we are going to die anyway then why not live our lives so that we can leave this world with no regrets and by leaving a legacy and reputation of goodness behind so that people will remember us as one of the good people. This whole thing reminds me of the question "what would you do if you knew that you had only one day/month/year left to live?" If answered honestly the question shows what kind of a person is in question.

One thing to understand with injustice is that once someone has done something evil we are usually already talking about a no-win scenario.There are many things of value which can't be measured in cash or simply fixed. Justice is like that. Once someone does something very wrong like for example killing someone the damage is already done and it cannot be undone. Many people talk about getting justice from the court of law but that's nothing more than institutionalized version of revenge designed to take justice out of the hands of the people so they won't go overboard with it and for example kill the whole family if someone in the family commits murder. So yes, there are things that can't be fixed or atoned for no matter how much the wrongdoer is punished or made to pay for it. Justice once broken cannot be fixed. The only fix is to prevent the wrong beforehand from ever being done.

But yes, it is as you say. Some people are just so bad that they don't deserve any of it. At least not the better new world if such were ever to come. What business would they have in it? Making it worse and just like the old one? No, we'd all be better off if some people wouldn't be allowed in it. We can hope that these people would change their ways but some people are just so broken beyond repair that it is practically impossible. So what should we do with them? I'd just say that we'd need a place on earth where the good people could gather and start over togetherwhile keeping the bad people out and throwing them out if they try to get in without completely changing their ways. The other option would be to gather all the bad people into one place in a similar way. The problem however we should first tackle is the definition of what is considered to be good and what is seens as bad.

But I'm preaching, lecturing or something like that again. That wasn't what I intended to do. Sorry about that.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 06:21
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nyrtzi



Joined: 08 Jul 2006
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nyrtzi
bitRAKE wrote:

The first 30 minutes covers misconceptions about DNA, and suggest the early environment is a much more likely cause.


Yes, that sounds about right. Us being humans after all means that we can use reason to overcome some of our programming. Then again I don't believe people are born bad or evil. People are what they choose (they can also choose not to choose and to simply try to delegate that choice along with the responsibility for it to someone else) and what other people try to make of them whether they do it intentionally or not. We all are a part of society and affect it but we don't control it. The way groups and communities work is a different matter. One could almost say they have a mind of their own.

Looking at the statistics and general picture of what kids grow up to be like tells us with great accuracy what the values of our society are and what kind of a system we have built. I could say that we've basically built a system where our values are a fitness function in a system which is based on evolutionary programming and we've pretty much always chosen to finetune the population with values that are bad and stupid thus leading to the current state of affairs. We've chosen it in one way or another. No point in blaming any god or any aliens for it. We've chosen a system which doesn't breed good unselfish people but instead a system which much more likely breeds selfish egoistic hedonists. Oh well. Let's all hope either a god or some alies save us from ourselves.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 06:34
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bitRAKE



Joined: 21 Jul 2003
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bitRAKE
I agree the choice is ours, but we aren't always given good choices. (ie. If we are in a negative environment - with no way to leave.) Babies don't have a choice of their environment, nor do hostages. The video describes epigenetic effects - where genes are triggered during development - modifying the resulting structural formation. Same happens during adolescence when hormones effect structural changes in the brain. The hostage case is different - once the condition is over, a person can use their individual choice to change their environment / actions.

I'm horribly out of touch with current youth generations. My brother and sister have many children, but my communication with them is typically from a distance. My goals beyond empathizing with them consist of empowering their ability to discover and explore the world. There is no God nor Aliens to save us - our adaptability will be the saving grace - even in the face of adversity. [I think Carl Jung said something about just giving children the tools - I'll look it up if you'd like.]
Post 24 Aug 2013, 07:05
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matefkr



Joined: 02 Sep 2007
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matefkr
i think most of these messages go to the moral of socialist world section and off topic.
on the other hand, with this information thingy.. this can be resolved, but whats the position? some optin is chosen.. and thats it.

about the gays prosecuted, there are societies where it is custom to do some sorta rape on female, so they fear gays because they know that these might rape some male (as rape is a common way of sexual contact), instead of concentrating on raping female, and might also they think that it is hard to have it all clean and they then put their dick into the female as well (provided they are even bysexual) because they know that many females got fucked by other men as well, and they fear that it would be then afterwards like if they fuck female and male (and almost like bisexual or gay, wich is feared and hated because it doesnt concentrate on raping female).


There is no need to throw out people from a system wich ensures that insiders dont rape kill , etc as much as possible yet (because there might be sentients wich are hurt without our knowledge, just too small to notice.. and etc).



People are choosy, not sure whats in the dna, but im pretty confident there is something wich wants to ensure some way of behavior in environments.
but.. about being choosy, consider, for example that for example the bad smell can be avoided if u use clothes,, or cleaning agents and stuck your nose with something wich makes good smell.. or u clean the other person (or someone else cleans the other person). about outside apearance, consider girls (although unot a girl i guess) they stroke all kinda uggly things if not talked against it.

so probably one should make about 7-9 times more girls at least replicating needed chromosome as much predetermination as possible, in vitro fertilization, and it would likely solve social porblems.. (either because they are kind, or due to all the males having abundant partners and there is lotsa male aggression and girls cuddle a lot anyway). in vitro fertilization is accepted and can be made so, then making girls is simple.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 08:25
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nyrtzi



Joined: 08 Jul 2006
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nyrtzi
matefkr wrote:
i think most of these messages go to the moral of socialist world section and off topic.
on the other hand, with this information thingy.. this can be resolved, but whats the position? some optin is chosen.. and thats it.


I wish message board software like one in use here had a feature which would allow dynamic threads/topics for a more natural flow of conversation. Anyone interested in writing up message board software with a built-in webserver and dynamic topics in FASM? Would this be a contribution for society and for making the world a better place. We don't all have to do something great and heroic to make a difference in the world. Even writing the right piece of software at the right time can matter.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 14:24
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matefkr



Joined: 02 Sep 2007
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matefkr
this would make for a better place if asnd as action takes place according to bettering of mankind.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 16:46
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
searching for a songs, listening to various performance,
it seems, artists did a lot more than us, they try to sing better, write more positive songs, bring people tears, give courage, give motivation, give memories.

all the music videos, movies, performances,
they actually did their part already,
Post 24 Aug 2013, 16:50
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matefkr



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matefkr
eh. I dont care who is better who is not. u can state something but u cant measure impact, unless u can.

They dont necesserily make the world a better place not all of them anyway.
depends on stuff.. realy it is rather simple.. or would be ... In theory media can show role models. but then only one kind of media must be available.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 22:47
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matefkr



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matefkr
if one media shows bad habbits to some individuals and the other shows good to the others it wont work obviously.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 22:55
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matefkr



Joined: 02 Sep 2007
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matefkr
humans are basicly sentient robots who can be educated to a range of things depending on environment, its only the question of tools available and some knowledge.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 22:55
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matefkr



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matefkr
Even one can have specific thoughts implanted into long term memory if there are tools connected to the hippocampus (this is the most radical way). im not sure how developed this technology is currently.
Post 24 Aug 2013, 22:56
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matefkr



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matefkr
now it is so that people are mostly bad (the majority), the majority of males are bad, and the majority of "uggly"-turned satisfied females are also bad. third genders are not known. some kids are good but some are bad (some are explicitly educated for bullying or harming others, some turn out to be such onto others who doesnt pay attention to them).
Post 24 Aug 2013, 22:59
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