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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
1.The action of enlightening or the state of being enlightened.
2. The attainment of spiritual knowledge or insight, esp. (in Buddhism) that which frees a person from the cycle of rebirth.

Enlightenment refers to the "full comprehension of a situation".

this is a catchy word, but let me try to define it somehow,

let see from the state un-enlighten to enlightenment
from the state of dont know to fully (know/aware/understand)

so this is some sort of process, and process == need time or equal lot of changes.

let check the idea, fully (know / aware / understand )

and through a belief system, aka some sort of self-illusion, we could claim we know everything, but does what we know is truth?

so, enlightenment deal with fully ( know / aware / understand ) truth.

how would one conscious exists at the moment (assume) he knows the whole truth?

and could a person reach the everything truth without somebody / something tell him, convey to him, influence him, suggest to him?

and how about verification of truth without external sources, bias, ideas and so on?

maybe enlightenment is a tiny moment of understood of a really tiny particular issue and

maybe

enlightenment doesnt deal with truth, it is a solution to make us accept something or go through or let go something, someone, or etc matters.
Post 19 Aug 2013, 23:46
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HaHaAnonymous



Joined: 02 Dec 2012
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HaHaAnonymous
[ Post removed by author. ]


Last edited by HaHaAnonymous on 28 Feb 2015, 20:12; edited 1 time in total
Post 20 Aug 2013, 00:28
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
it was posted on heap, you saw it in other section HaHa?
Post 20 Aug 2013, 00:37
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bitRAKE



Joined: 21 Jul 2003
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bitRAKE
I've always defined enlightenment in terms of suffering, or in the Zen tradition of knowing one's self. Are there inherent processes within the human condition which create suffering? Mostly, a person can only answer this for themselves - to advise another of their internal workings is very error prone. Not that we can't help other people.

Will you forever be a mystery to yourself?

How does one's self-knowledge effect their actions in the world?

Maybe my use of the term is uncommon? I do not know.

Of course, there are many traps even in self-discovery.
Post 20 Aug 2013, 02:20
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
what is suffering?
suffering created because we couldnt accept things as it is,
or there really exists things that we hardly could accept, eg. born defect, illness, etc more,

why a sane person need to accept those situations? dna mutation inside our body, an eye for an eye, and more,

for things that already happened, we got no choice but to accept, the more you reject, the more suffering you got to face.

this is a imperfect world because not much people want to live in a perfect world, do we have the ability and capability to create a much better world,

the answer is yes, but not much people inside 7 billion want a much better world.


existence is a mystery, because we hardly obtain the truth,
when enlightenment is a guess work and then believe situation, that is not really so enlightenment.

bitRAKE wrote:

How does one's self-knowledge effect their actions in the world?

all the words cause chain reaction, like what we all did here.
to know more, eg. know many short-cuts to a destination, we could choose based on what we know.

bitRAKE wrote:

Of course, there are many traps even in self-discovery.

self discovery is probably the only valid way to understand something really deeper,
people call it wheel re-invent, but the re-invent process surely teach a person to understand the problem more deeper, imo.
Post 20 Aug 2013, 08:27
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HaHaAnonymous



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HaHaAnonymous
[ Post removed by author. ]


Last edited by HaHaAnonymous on 28 Feb 2015, 20:12; edited 1 time in total
Post 20 Aug 2013, 14:36
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bitRAKE



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bitRAKE
I would rather die than believe people do not want a better world. Even as they try to beat it out of me, I will entertain the notion that some good is to come of it. It is a suffering I welcome.

The world will never be a perfect place. The process of existence itself creates turmoil - we couldn't be here otherwise.

That's all the truth for now.
Post 20 Aug 2013, 17:24
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matefkr



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matefkr
suffering is when it is bad. its an axiom. its bad. its not good and its bad. the enjoyment is the good.. it is good. wich is also an axiom. these somtimes coincide with wanting to avoid something or wanting to aproach something (respectively)
Post 20 Aug 2013, 18:52
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
HaHaAnonymous wrote:
Quote:
it was posted on heap, you saw it in other section HaHa?

I was just kidding!


Laughing k, i thought i accidentally posted it somewhere else.
Post 20 Aug 2013, 19:21
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
bitRAKE wrote:

I would rather die than believe people do not want a better world.

i am quite sure people dont want a corrupted and negative world,
but that certainly doesnt mean they want a clean and positive world.

to not against negative, means ~ one will get pull into negative.

bitRAKE wrote:

The world will never be a perfect place.

not a perfect place, but does it produces perfect moments?

bitRAKE wrote:

The process of existence itself creates turmoil.

let me ponder about this =)
Post 20 Aug 2013, 19:33
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bitRAKE



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bitRAKE
matefkr wrote:
suffering is when it is bad.
Suffering and happiness are not opposites nor inversely proportional. Look at the biology and work up to experience, and you will know this is true.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_petite_mort

The body has many chemicals which are released to make existence possible. From the moment we are ejected from the womb we begin to learn about our separation. Separation from the source, separation from each other, and even ourselves (we are not our thoughts). Yet, life would not exist if that is all we learned. The very same actions create an understanding of unity, fellowship, community.

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Post 20 Aug 2013, 22:55
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
if let go everything, accept everything as it is, as if we are only viewers without feeling,
what good or positive could come out from such attitude?

when crime, injustice, ego, massacre, war, totalitarian, and etc happened around us.

one sit there, let go, enlighten, bliss, until someone else shot him with bullet,
and he just sits there yeah, no concern.

when one choose certain choice, to fulfill own desire, be it positive or negative, without consider others, is that selfish? maybe i got to admit, it is selfish when we stop thinking as a whole?

but when our empathy hardly cover people around us, such ironic,

you know,
i thought about this yesterday,

each human is PROC with if then elseif else.
combine together, we are a huge if then elseif else
and we are all actually running inside one huge program

all the chain reactions could be translated into if then elseif else.
Post 21 Aug 2013, 14:03
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bitRAKE



Joined: 21 Jul 2003
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bitRAKE
sleepsleep wrote:
suffering created because we couldnt accept things as it is
sleepsleep wrote:
if let go everything, accept everything as it is, as if we are only viewers without feeling, what good or positive could come out from such attitude?
I'm confused by "accept [every]thing as it is".

[I am speaking about the conscious level, complete inaction would not be possible.] I think there is a process of trying to understand - which requires inaction; and then there is a process of action (which includes feeling/thinking/etc).

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Post 21 Aug 2013, 15:38
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nyrtzi



Joined: 08 Jul 2006
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nyrtzi
Accepting everything as it is? So what is it that separates this from fatalism? Or is fate something you can change? Can we even know what our fate is? Is free will merely an illusion or a form of hopeful thinking we've come up with so that we wouldn't have to accept that we have no freedom nor a will of our own any more than a gear or a component in a perfect machine? Are we no different from snowflakes or amoebas anything else than how complex we are as machines? Or are we simply supposed to accept all of this alongside with all the suffering in the world and just try to concentrate on all the small good things we've been blessed with and be happy while being aware of all of this?
Post 21 Aug 2013, 16:59
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
bitRAKE wrote:

I'm confused by "accept [every]thing as it is".

accept everything that already happened, no lament, no regret,
accept everything as if, they happened as expected, they happened as how things would work out.

idk if enlightenment equal to complete inaction [ since whatever that need to be understood are understood ], but i perceive it as nearby it.

idk how the desire to think arise, who call my PROC?
and it seems we dont have the STEP feature for each instruction,
suddenly, we got the result in EAX.

even at this moment, we all here trying to discuss and understand more,

we still having issue with, what is consciousness.
how the i know i am conscious stuff arise in our consciousness.

Rolling Eyes
Post 21 Aug 2013, 17:27
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nyrtzi



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nyrtzi
sleepsleep wrote:

we still having issue with, what is consciousness.
how the i know i am conscious stuff arise in our consciousness.
Rolling Eyes


And if you think of it as a reflective state machine what kind of an algorithm would it need to be able to perceive itself? What would the data structures be like?
Post 21 Aug 2013, 18:13
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
nyrtzi wrote:
sleepsleep wrote:

we still having issue with, what is consciousness.
how the i know i am conscious stuff arise in our consciousness.
Rolling Eyes


And if you think of it as a reflective state machine what kind of an algorithm would it need to be able to perceive itself? What would the data structures be like?


well, idk really, but here is what i guess, based on what i understood so far,

there is a counter for each if..then..elseif..else execution.
there is a counter for [ to run or skip each ] if..then..elseif..else execution.
there is a counter for total result value recorded after above execution.

execution that return high value will increase the counter to run or skip

higher execution of if..then..elseif..else will put arrange that PROC code into permanent memory area.

so whether we remember something or not, it is based on the frequency of execution,


the idea, i am aware, i am conscious could be just one branch of if..then..elseif..else, probably scare the hell of many people.

consciousness then would be just like how we eat our food,
how we wash our body, bath, cycling, running,

what i said is a guess work, i am not really sure about the truth yet.
Post 22 Aug 2013, 00:41
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matefkr



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matefkr
wow. what and why are we talking about where?
Post 22 Aug 2013, 08:10
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bitRAKE



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bitRAKE
What about binary lambda calculus? (instead of a state machine, it has a state machine internally) Not that I think the brain works that way, but more as very simple machine which can self-perceive.
Post 22 Aug 2013, 09:03
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sleepsleep



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sleepsleep
that is beyond my knowledge, i know only simple maths.
Post 22 Aug 2013, 13:27
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