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HaHaAnonymous 06 Feb 2013, 16:01
[ Post removed by author. ]
Last edited by HaHaAnonymous on 28 Feb 2015, 21:42; edited 1 time in total |
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06 Feb 2013, 16:01 |
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ACP 07 Feb 2013, 00:18
DOS386 wrote: > The biggest drawback of big flat mode / unreal mode are: While you might dislike Windows you also can't run under DESQview 386 which was by far the best task switcher of its time. For me this was actually a drawback. DOS386 wrote:
As f0dder pointed it out already: can you propose a solution for those who need EMS memory? |
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07 Feb 2013, 00:18 |
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ACP 07 Feb 2013, 00:25
f0dder wrote: Btw, why PharLap as a second? Never used it, back then I thought DOS4G/W was king? And later, we got the free WDOSX extender? First of all if you have been using DOS4G/W you will probably dislike PharLap 386 Dos Extender due to provided selectors by extenders and their mapping. However the TNT version offered what hx is offering many years later: Win32 API from DOS. PharLap extender also came with more advanced own set of tools. Now hx is only real competitor but again those who has been using Watcom C with DOS4G/W will probably dislike PharLap tools. |
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07 Feb 2013, 00:25 |
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DOS386 07 Feb 2013, 05:30
> Speaking of which, do you know of any x64 DOS
> extenders? Personally don't see much use NO. But there used to be a forum discussion about such (see FAQ) ... now dead > Got an alternative for people who run applications > that need EMS memory? - EMS magic (used to be freeware) - JEMM (you can load and unload it as needed ... if a few conditions are met) - Upgrade the app _________________ Bug Nr.: 12345 Title: Hello World program compiles to 100 KB !!! Status: Closed: NOT a Bug |
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07 Feb 2013, 05:30 |
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DOS386 07 Feb 2013, 05:32
BTW, I see really no point to use Pharao or
DOG4/SW nowadays ... use HX or WDOSX or D3X |
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07 Feb 2013, 05:32 |
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f0dder 07 Feb 2013, 11:54
ACP wrote: While you might dislike Windows you also can't run under DESQview 386 which was by far the best task switcher of its time. For me this was actually a drawback. Never used DESQview myself, but I did use QEMM386 for amazing amounts of low memory - this also ran DOS in v86, iirc? ACP wrote: First of all if you have been using DOS4G/W you will probably dislike PharLap 386 Dos Extender due to provided selectors by extenders and their mapping. However the TNT version offered what hx is offering many years later: Win32 API from DOS. PharLap extender also came with more advanced own set of tools. Now hx is only real competitor but again those who has been using Watcom C with DOS4G/W will probably dislike PharLap tools. Can't remember if I actually used DOS4G/W myself, but it was used in a lot of games - I did used Tran's PMODE (and later, PMODE/W, which was designed as a drop-in for DOS4GW). At that time I would probably have disliked PharLap, since I was in the rabid "I hated Windows, DOS forever!!!" phase of my life... I knew the name, just never happened to come by the extender. I also did rather quickly accept that using PE for 32-bit DOS wasn't so bad after all - WDOSX is probably the extender I used for the longest period of time. I've been through quite a few - the ones I can remember are: PMODE, PMODE/W, WDOSX as mentioned above. Adam Seychell's DOS32 (because it was used by Johans Prins' 32bit pascal compiler, p32). CWSDPMI (from djgpp - can't remember if I used djgpp early enough to have used the previous GO32, but I remember the name). DOS/32A (another drop-in for WDOSX). ...and probably a few more that were too esoteric for me to remember |
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07 Feb 2013, 11:54 |
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A$M 07 Feb 2013, 18:47
Ok, I admit that I just confusing everyone and myself.
My goal is to create a game using FASM. The game will be two-dimensional and run at DOS (so it should run on Windows, in the NTVDM, without Win32). But the scenario should not be confined to one screen, will be immense. I researched better and I think the best alternative is the "unreal mode" (or "irreal mode"or something). Can anyone write a hello world in "unreal mode"? (I could not understand very well the source code of FASM for DOS) |
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07 Feb 2013, 18:47 |
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f0dder 07 Feb 2013, 18:51
A$M wrote: I researched better and I think the best alternative is the "unreal mode" (or "irreal mode"or something). That's not going to work under NTVDM - only pure DOS. If the focus of your project is the game, and not playing with protected-mode details or bank-switching EMS memory, just use a dos extender (Japheth's HX probably being the best bet). _________________ - carpe noctem |
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07 Feb 2013, 18:51 |
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A$M 07 Feb 2013, 19:02
f0dder wrote:
1. Okay, so can someone write a hello world running at a DOS extender? Can to be Japheth's HX. 2. If I use a DOS extender it will run on Windows at NTVDM? It's important. 3. Before running my game at DOS, the user will need to run the Japheth's HX executable, or something? |
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07 Feb 2013, 19:02 |
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f0dder 07 Feb 2013, 21:20
A$M wrote: 1. Okay, so can someone write a hello world running at a DOS extender? Can to be Japheth's HX. 1. Start by heading here and looking at the documentation. To get started, simply write a win32 console application - it's that simple (almost feels like cheating!). 2. Yep, it will - won't be supported on 64bit Windows, but (generally) works fine on 32bit. 3. Nope, you replace the MZ-exe part from the "this program requires win32" to one that automatically loads the necessary stuff. You do need a couple of executables alongside your own exe, though. If you would like one single exe, check out WDOSX - it can embed the dos extender (and even DLLs, if you use any), and supports executable compression. _________________ - carpe noctem |
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07 Feb 2013, 21:20 |
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A$M 07 Feb 2013, 21:49
So, with a DOS extender can I run Win32 console applications?
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07 Feb 2013, 21:49 |
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A$M 07 Feb 2013, 22:08
Well... I downloaded the Japheth's DOS Extender. I can compile as: MS COFF and MZ. But, how to "link" the .obj file?
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07 Feb 2013, 22:08 |
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DOS386 08 Feb 2013, 09:58
> So, with a DOS extender can I run Win32 console applications?
With HX you can run some/many > Well... I downloaded the Japheth's DOS Extender. I can compile as: > MS COFF and MZ. But, how to "link" the .obj file? FASM is NOT a linker. Why didn't you read my older posts http://board.flatassembler.net/topic.php?t=8670 ? |
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08 Feb 2013, 09:58 |
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A$M 08 Feb 2013, 13:03
DOS386 wrote: FASM is NOT a linker. I KNOW!!! I downloaded a file from Japhet's site. It comes with some examples to FASM. When I compile the file "SAMPLEMZ.ASM" (MZ) it generates an executable. But when I compile the "SAMPLED.ASM" or "SAMPLEW.ASM" (both MS COFF) it generates a .OBJ file that needs to be linked. In the .BAT file (which serves to make the process automatically) appears "FASM", then "link", then "patchPE" (which probably translates to a PE executable). I want to do it this way because the program seems to me simpler... H E L P ! ! ! |
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08 Feb 2013, 13:03 |
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DOS386 08 Feb 2013, 13:23
> But when I compile the "SAMPLED.ASM" or "SAMPLEW.ASM" (both MS COFF)
> it generates a .OBJ file that needs to be linked. See posts above. Either get a linker or don't use COFF. > "patchPE" (which probably translates to a PE executable). NO. PE->PX > I want to do it this way because the program seems to me simpler... > H E L P ! ! ! See posts above (I'm not yet locking this ...). |
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08 Feb 2013, 13:23 |
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A$M 08 Feb 2013, 17:32
I use the command "link SampleD.obj /SUBSYSTEM:CONSOLE /ENTRY:start /STUB:..\..\bin\loadpex.bin /FIXED:NO /OPT:NOWIN98" and the linker returns:
Quote: OPTLINK (R) for Win32 Release 8.00.5 Help please! What I do? |
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08 Feb 2013, 17:32 |
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f0dder 08 Feb 2013, 18:03
You're assembling to COFF?
Iirc the digital mars toolchain uses the old OMF .obj format. Grab a linker that works with COFF |
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08 Feb 2013, 18:03 |
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baldr 09 Feb 2013, 06:18
DOS386 wrote: FASM is NOT a linker. |
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09 Feb 2013, 06:18 |
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A$M 09 Feb 2013, 12:38
f0dder wrote: You're assembling to COFF? Thanks f0dder!! I used the Microsoft (R) Incremental Linker Version 5.12.8078 and it worked! Many thanks to all!! |
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09 Feb 2013, 12:38 |
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