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mattst88



Joined: 12 May 2006
Posts: 260
Location: South Carolina
mattst88
Tyler wrote:
Huh? What do you mean? Confused I get that feeling with Debian's snobbishness(I cringe upon hearing "free software").


You don't like free software? What the f is wrong with you? Do you know what is?

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Post 09 Jun 2010, 00:22
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
It's not that it's free, it's that Debian is an a-hole about the fact that it has to be free. My problem with the phrase "free software" is that it's over used by Debian.

A Linux related question: What's the likelihood a self compiled Linux kernel will work with my Ubuntu installation. I'd like to compile my own w/ mods.
Post 09 Jun 2010, 00:33
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TmX



Joined: 02 Mar 2006
Posts: 821
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia
TmX
Tyler wrote:
It's not that it's free, it's that Debian is an a-hole about the fact that it has to be free


No. Debian doesn't has to be free. And so does Slackware, Arch, Open Suse, etc.
If you want a 100% free distro, try gNewSense, Ututo, etc.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Linux_distributions_endorsed_by_the_Free_Software_Foundation

Tyler wrote:

A Linux related question: What's the likelihood a self compiled Linux kernel will work with my Ubuntu installation. I'd like to compile my own w/ mods.


The most annoyoing part in compiling your own kernel is the configuring part.
A small error could lead to kernel panic. So it's a good idea to use the config provided by your distro as a guideline.
Aside from that, it's pretty straightforward.
Post 10 Jun 2010, 12:28
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
Hey edfed, look at this. A Debian-supported FreeBSD kernel port to Debian. Some benchmarks comparing the two. Skip to the second page for the graphs.
Post 10 Jul 2010, 04:55
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ManOfSteel



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1154
ManOfSteel
kFreeBSD ain't Linux since Linux is precisely the kernel kFreeBSD is missing...
Post 10 Jul 2010, 11:53
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
What, in your opinion, is wrong with the kFreeBSD kernel? The benchmarks I linked to seemed to show they are almost equal, both being better at different things.
Post 11 Jul 2010, 00:06
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ManOfSteel



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1154
ManOfSteel
Nothing wrong with the kernel. It's FreeBSD's (minus a few things) so it's great! Razz

What's wrong is the entire project. It's a chimera, a Dr. Frankenstein monster.
FreeBSD has been developed for more than 16 years as a complete OS (unlike the Linux kernel) where the kernel and userland go hand in hand and where there's a unified source tree and licensing scheme. Separating the two and grafting its kernel to a "foreign" userland is quite weird and provides no real advantages.
The FreeBSD userland has nothing to envy to a GNU userland and if you're missing a few GNU applications you can just as well install them from FreeBSD's port tree... or as binary packages, well well.
And if you want a nanny, you can use "distributions" made by FreeBSD developers and users as well as independents (e.g. DesktopBSD, PC-BSD, GhostBSD, etc.)

I remain unconvinced about the last section of this "why". Maybe kFreeBSD is good for experimenting and playing around, but for end users? I guess I'll have to follow the disclaimer above Rolling Eyes
Post 11 Jul 2010, 09:39
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
I think it's part of GNU's attempt to show that it can exist separate from Linux. They tried with Hurd and got nowhere, so they decided they'd steal some random kernel and splice it with their userland.

I tried to install FreeBSD itself a few months ago, the installer was really intimidating. Not as bad as Slackware's, but bad. Smile
Post 11 Jul 2010, 10:18
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ManOfSteel



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1154
ManOfSteel
Tyler wrote:
They tried with Hurd and got nowhere

Exactly! 20 years later and they're still "working on it" (or not).

Tyler wrote:
I tried to install FreeBSD itself a few months ago, the installer was really intimidating. Not as bad as Slackware's, but bad. Smile

Ah, come on! You find assembly coding fun and sysinstall is intimidating? Wink
Anyway, I don't really think it's so difficult to use and IIRC the handbook has 7 screenshot-illustrated pages dealing with it.
Note that according to its man page, it is "a prototype which lasted several years past its expiration date and is greatly in need of death." Smile And some (read, many) avoid it completely and use livefs to extract the entire system. That's right, BSDs' "setup.exe" is really made of 2 Bourne (Almquist, actually) shell scripts, hehe.
Post 11 Jul 2010, 13:32
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
Quote:

Ah, come on! You find assembly coding fun and sysinstall is intimidating? Wink

Hey, I'm getting there Smile. At least I'm not this idiot anymore. The primary way I use fasm now, is calling it from my kernel's makefile. You were right, makefiles are really useful for simplifying the build process. I've got one to build my kernel, and when it's ready to start debugging, I'll make one to make a bootable image.

Besides, I'm sure there's some FreeBSD based "distro"(Are they called that for Unix?) that has a modern installer. After all, there's even an officially unsupported live cd. I haven't taken the time to dl it yet.
Post 11 Jul 2010, 16:45
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ManOfSteel



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1154
ManOfSteel
Tyler wrote:
FreeBSD based "distro"(Are they called that for Unix?)

It's usually "desktop-oriented operating system based on <...>" or "operating system for desktop users based on <...>" or something like that.

Tyler wrote:
there's even an officially unsupported live cd. I haven't taken the time to dl it yet.

Which one?
Post 11 Jul 2010, 17:24
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
> Which one?
Further research into the one I was referring to returns that it is based on FreeBSD version 4.6. FreeBSD's now releasing 8.1 RCs. Kinda outdated... But I've found PC-BSD and DesktopBSD, which are based on FreeBSD, but are know for being more user friendly, and having graphical installers.
Post 11 Jul 2010, 17:52
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
Actually, sysinstall ain't that bad. The first time I guess I tried the "Custom" option, but I just tried again with the "Standard" install, and it was easy. I thought a commandline install of Linux was barren, but I don't even have "dir" Shocked. I was going to look around in /usr/bin to find a browser or something, but I can't even list the contents of a directory. Smile
Post 12 Jul 2010, 21:06
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MHajduk



Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 6034
Location: Poland
MHajduk
Tyler wrote:
I thought a commandline install of Linux was barren, but I don't even have "dir" Shocked. I was going to look around in /usr/bin to find a browser or something, but I can't even list the contents of a directory. Smile
Use ls command instead (it's Linux analog of the dir command under DOS). Wink

BTW, have you ever tried Midnight Commander, visual file manager for Linux?
Post 12 Jul 2010, 21:12
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
MHajduk wrote:

BTW, have you ever tried Midnight Commander, visual file manager for Linux?
No, but it definitely looks better than piping through less. Wink I use a GUI on Linux, but usually install commandline and go from there. But if I ever find myself looking through directories on the cmdline, I'll use that.
Post 12 Jul 2010, 21:44
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ManOfSteel



Joined: 02 Feb 2005
Posts: 1154
ManOfSteel
Tyler wrote:
Actually, sysinstall ain't that bad. The first time I guess I tried the "Custom" option, but I just tried again with the "Standard" install, and it was easy.

But when using the custom setup, you're done in less than 10 steps!

Tyler wrote:
it definitely looks better than piping through less.

Real geeks use echo to browse the tree and cat to write texts Very Happy
Post 13 Jul 2010, 00:10
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Enko



Joined: 03 Apr 2007
Posts: 678
Location: Mar del Plata
Enko
http://www.puppylinux.org/

Puppy linux? ^^

I´m using it now on my netbook on an USB drive.
Comes with really light xwindow, have wifi drivers, identified my monitor with the max resolution 1280x768 (when slax, nor knoppix did it)
It let you make a File on the Pendrive so you can save all the configs there every time you shutdown.
It´s not intended to be installed on HD, but to work from usb drives. And does it greate.

Its even reconginzed the Via chip, so I can use the e_powersaver, to set the cpu clock between 800mhz and 1200mhz. In WinXp it only let you put in 800 and 1600. Or the dinamic switching.


ubuntu, kubunto, xubuntu did not startup.

ubunte netbook remix, the desktop is amazingly slow, really slow, like playing GTA4 on a pentium 2 with no VideoCard.

Debian Live did not startup to.


its about 100mb
http://puppylinux.org/main/index.php?file=Download%20Latest%20Release.htm

and comes with a set of good apps.
Post 14 Jul 2010, 22:58
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
Enko wrote:

Its even reconginzed the Via chip, ...

Don't all? The kernel that comes with Ubuntu prints all the cpuid eax=0 that it supports, Via is mentioned in one of them(I'm running Vista right now, so I can't quote exactly.).

How much memory do you have? Ubuntu Desktop runs fine with 1g and can handle a lot less depending on what you run. I have an Ubuntu-based LAMP server(It's really just an old computer I run Apache and PHP on.) that has a 3GHz P4 and 1GB memory. It runs smoothly running LAMP and functioning as a desktop at the same time.

I'll try Puppy Linux. I have Slax on a usb, but the way the Slax developers set it up is really screwed up. Does Puppy save changes between boots? Particularly, changes to "/etc"?
Post 15 Jul 2010, 12:00
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edfed



Joined: 20 Feb 2006
Posts: 4237
Location: 2018
edfed
i seek a linux for:

PMMX @ 233MHz 32MB ram, 2GB Compact flash, 2GB Hard disk, two ethernet cards, maybe two sound cards...
Post 15 Jul 2010, 12:16
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Tyler



Joined: 19 Nov 2009
Posts: 1216
Location: NC, USA
Tyler
Is there a modern OS that can handle 32MB of RAM? I've never checked the memory usage of a fresh CLI install of a Linux distro.
Post 16 Jul 2010, 02:45
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