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Windows 11 Upgrade
Yay
8%
 8%  [ 1 ]
Nay
91%
 91%  [ 11 ]
Total Votes : 12

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donn



Joined: 05 Mar 2010
Posts: 215
donn
Windows 11 Upgrade: Yay or Nay and why?

Should we upgrade? I have a tablet that may be too slow to run it but that is Khronos Vulkan capable and a separate computer that is more powerful.

I guess UI changes that make things more stripped down are fine, hard to tell what actual experience is like or if way to revert.

Other than that, not aware of any downsides except things could be going in a more 'controlled' direction with fewer options:
- Think I heard of silent updates coming out
- The push towards Windows Hello seems a bit invasive, I'd rather they just have my password on file not my face
etc, in which case the switch to Linux may be more appealing. Not sure if anyone is aware of any drawbacks or any big changes in the Windows API that may warrant some hesitation. Ill be investigating, but think the upgrade is available now... I dont have strong opinion, just a vague high level sentiment it COULD be a change in direction.
Post 08 Oct 2021, 02:05
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Roman



Joined: 21 Apr 2012
Posts: 1082
Roman
Amd processors have problem with win 11
Win 11 decreased 15% amd cpus speed.
Win 11 sucks

And Microsoft work on Windows 12!
Post 08 Oct 2021, 05:56
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 18222
Location: In your JS exploiting you and your system
revolution
That would be a big no from me.

If MS has a mandatory requirement to visually watch me then NFW.

I have never used a camera and hope to continue that trend. MS saying "because security" is not a suitable excuse IMO.
Post 08 Oct 2021, 06:10
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Overclick



Joined: 11 Jul 2020
Posts: 394
Location: Ukraine
Overclick
Virtual machine is all I need from win11 to make sure my projects fully compatible with it.
I don't like that primitive minimal mobile design 8+ at huge monitor that why I still use 2008r2 with aero enabled.
Post 08 Oct 2021, 06:56
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sinsi



Joined: 10 Aug 2007
Posts: 738
Location: Adelaide
sinsi
Start button - defaults to middle bottom, can only move it to bottom left.
Skinny scroll bars. Textbox with focus has an ugly blue bar at the bottom.
Context menus changed - taskbar's has one option "Taskbar settings", cut/copy/paste now icons, no text.
Settings dialog totally different, more fun finding where things are.
On the plus side, it's stable, fast, works OK I guess Smile

Windows 11 Insider Preview, Dev Channel, using for a couple of months??
Post 08 Oct 2021, 07:43
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Ali.Z



Joined: 08 Jan 2018
Posts: 473
Ali.Z
https://www.microsoft.com/security/blog/2021/10/04/windows-11-offers-chip-to-cloud-protection-to-meet-the-new-security-challenges-of-hybrid-work/
Quote:
found that more than 80 percent of Vice Presidents and above admitted to experiencing a hardware attack in the last two years.

Laughing

https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/enable-tpm-2-0-on-your-pc-1fd5a332-360d-4f46-a1e7-ae6b0c90645c

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications

i had another link to ms pages but i lost that link, basically that specific webpage says they will drop support for intel 7th gen processors because they cant run windows properly at desired speed and they are claiming that 7th gen processors have some security issues Laughing

p.s. im happy linux user Very Happy although i have windows 7 machine, but i rarely use it.

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Post 08 Oct 2021, 19:44
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Furs



Joined: 04 Mar 2016
Posts: 1648
Furs
I've been using Linux now for almost 10 years. Windows only in VMs. If you have USB hardware that doesn't have drivers for Linux, just use it with a Windows VM and USB passthrough.

I'll probably get a Windows 11 VM at some point, but I keep them separate. The on-disk image is usually read-only and only a "modified" image on top of it is created everytime on a ram disk (tmpfs in Linux). So I can easily reset its state back to how I want it after I use it by simply deleting it from RAM or shutting down the PC.

I still have and use Windows XP VMs and Windows 98 (but the latter rarely), I don't like throwing software away that I used in the past, it's nice to know I still have it available if I need to, without bloating my drives (it's just a single image file, compressed with squashfs on Linux).
Post 09 Oct 2021, 13:12
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FlierMate



Joined: 21 Jan 2021
Posts: 129
FlierMate
On a laptop that is 12 years old, I could not afford a new PC for Windows 11. I still struggle with 3GB RAM.

Frankly speaking, I am a M$ fan, from WFW 3.11, 95, 98, ME, XP, Vista, 7, 8, 8.1 all the way up to 10. If you ask my opinion, WinXP had the best icon set.
I get easily organized with Windows, because I am too used to it, which is not a healthy sign. To keep my mind fresh, I would rather explore Linux and am a happy Debian user so far.

Eventually I might try Win11, but certainly not at the moment. So, "nay" for Windows 11 upgrade.
Post 09 Oct 2021, 14:06
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 10041
Location: ˛                             ⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣Posts: 0010456
sleepsleep
all pc laptop will default come with win 11, we dont have a say on this matter,

i just hope they allow license downgrade from win 11 to 10,

to be frank, all device with less than i3 processor power, 4gb memory and ssd, failed to run win 10 smoothly, sucks like hell, practically, unusable, piece of shit,

and i dont think this shit will run any better with win 11,

donn wrote:

- Think I heard of silent updates coming out

they started showing this "This PC doesn’t currently meet all the system requirements for Windows 11." under windows update,

they will certainly push this shit into current windows 10 users, no doubt,
Post 09 Oct 2021, 19:44
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macomics



Joined: 26 Jan 2021
Posts: 167
Location: Russia
macomics
sleepsleep wrote:
to be frank, all device with less than i3 processor power, 4gb memory and ssd, failed to run win 10 smoothly, sucks like hell, practically, unusable, piece of shit,
Microsoft is still hoping that another miracle will happen and RAM will abruptly become more than 1 Mb (read terabytes) and in a couple of years, it will be more than 16 Mb (read terabytes) and hard drives will increase speeds to 100 Mbps (read Gbps)
Post 09 Oct 2021, 20:36
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 10041
Location: ˛                             ⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣Posts: 0010456
sleepsleep
macomics wrote:
Microsoft is still hoping that another miracle will happen and RAM will abruptly become more than 1 Mb (read terabytes) and in a couple of years, it will be more than 16 Mb (read terabytes) and hard drives will increase speeds to 100 Mbps (read Gbps)

i dont think their developers or idiots inside microsoft windows development team really use a celeron, or just pentium to run their daily activities, please eat your own dog food,

those idiot hardware oem partners are another cause of this shit,

fgs, just create a f lite win 10 version for those under powered devices,

you cant install windows 7 or 8 in modern devices now, f u microsoft and oem hardware,

if windows 7 can runs smooth without ssd, under 4gb, and using celeron, basically ms are devolving,

they are asking more power to do the same job, wtf, and the shitty part is, their were doing terribly compare to before after granted more power, wtf,
Post 09 Oct 2021, 21:56
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revolution
When all else fails, read the source


Joined: 24 Aug 2004
Posts: 18222
Location: In your JS exploiting you and your system
revolution
sleepsleep wrote:
they are asking more power to do the same job, wtf, and the shitty part is, their were doing terribly compare to before after granted more power, wtf,
They are doing more jobs. They are now watching you through the camera. And, of course, stealing more of your private data back into their "cloud".

So that is where all the extra computing power goes, not to you, but for their own use.

Twisted Evil
Post 09 Oct 2021, 22:25
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macomics



Joined: 26 Jan 2021
Posts: 167
Location: Russia
macomics
This is the fate of all monopolists. While Steve was there, he somehow balanced them. And now they have completely lost the coast.
revolution wrote:
So that is where all the extra computing power goes, not to you, but for their own use.
And all this behind the SAFETY shield
Post 09 Oct 2021, 22:33
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Ali.Z



Joined: 08 Jan 2018
Posts: 473
Ali.Z
Code:
push dword [bankruptcy]
call [microsoft]
mov eax,[another_os]
jmp eax    

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Post 10 Oct 2021, 05:36
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 10041
Location: ˛                             ⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣Posts: 0010456
sleepsleep
Post 13 Oct 2021, 15:44
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macomics



Joined: 26 Jan 2021
Posts: 167
Location: Russia
macomics
Ali.Z wrote:
Code:
push dword [bankruptcy]
call [microsoft]
mov eax,[another_os]
jmp eax    

not so anymore
Code:
@@:
sub rsp, 32
mov rcx, [bankruptcy] ; 4 billion is not enough
lea rax, [microsoft]
call rax
add rsp, 32
add [bankruptcy], rax ; Now they are already assigning themselves a cashback!
jle BSOD ; only one reason
or rax, rax
jnz @b
call [another_os]
or rax, rax
jz @b
@@: pause
jmp @b    
Post 13 Oct 2021, 17:55
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Ali.Z



Joined: 08 Jan 2018
Posts: 473
Ali.Z
sleepsleep wrote:
https://www.theverge.com/2021/10/13/22723998/windows-11-update-amd-ryzen-cpu-performance-worse

how much intel paid ms for this mess, Laughing


M$ addressed this issue weeks ago (late September), they mentioned that many of AMD chips aren't working properly.

wondering if its a plan against AMD and/or pushing Intel chips just like they did earlier.

macomics wrote:
; 4 billion is not enough

:facepalm:
yea I forgot, billy have trillions Laughing

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Post 14 Oct 2021, 06:01
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Feryno



Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 479
Location: Czech republic, Slovak republic
Feryno
I had to install it, just to test my hypervisors.
As I did not want to mess primary UEFI booting OS with this new OS (with unknown stability) I decided to install it on secondary HDD and boot via BIOS and of course then there is no secure boot. This is not allowed by ms (uefi and secureboot must be enabled, also TPM ver. 2.0 must be present) but it is possible to replace one file used by installer with older one and then installation passes flawlessly. The OS later does not check, only installer does (ver. 22000.194). I installed from downloaded *.iso file. When running online installer it is allegedly possible to manually delete some file (I did not try that way) to pass these restrictions too.
Post 17 Oct 2021, 18:02
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sleepsleep



Joined: 05 Oct 2006
Posts: 10041
Location: ˛                             ⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣⁣Posts: 0010456
sleepsleep
Feryno wrote:

I had to install it, just to test my hypervisors.

you mean your own coded custom hypervisors or what?

Feryno wrote:

As I did not want to mess primary UEFI booting OS with this new OS

i thought uefi booting is about having a disk with gpt partition style, then a partition with fat32 filesystem,
let say i got mounted system fat32 in p0 (S:), p1 : msr, p2 : win10 (C:), p3: win11 (D:), p4: win11 debug (E:)

i just do the following to boot C: win10
bcdboot C:\windows /s S:

to switch w11 debug, format fat32, then bcdboot E:\windows /s S:

Feryno wrote:

but it is possible to replace one file used by installer with older one and then installation passes flawlessly.

what file?

i might need to test it very near future, they gonna deploy windows 11 on every new device, sigh, new mess,
Post 17 Oct 2021, 23:08
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Feryno



Joined: 23 Mar 2005
Posts: 479
Location: Czech republic, Slovak republic
Feryno
sleepsleep wrote:
Feryno wrote:

I had to install it, just to test my hypervisors.

[0] you mean your own coded custom hypervisors or what?

Feryno wrote:

As I did not want to mess primary UEFI booting OS with this new OS

[1] i thought uefi booting is about having a disk with gpt partition style, then a partition with fat32 filesystem,
let say i got mounted system fat32 in p0 (SSmile, p1 : msr, p2 : win10 (CSmile, p3: win11 (DSmile, p4: win11 debug (ESmile

i just do the following to boot C: win10
bcdboot C:\windows /s S:

to switch w11 debug, format fat32, then bcdboot E:\windows /s S:

Feryno wrote:

but it is possible to replace one file used by installer with older one and then installation passes flawlessly.

[2] what file?

i might need to test it very near future, they gonna deploy windows 11 on every new device, sigh, new mess,

[0] yes these hypervisors are written in FASM, I'm developing them for the past 10 years, they are for Intel and AMD, they can start from running ms win x64 as a *.sys driver (company has to digitally sign the driver and sent to sign to MS to append second signature which lasts some time and I have to bother colleague with this task), I can start them before OS using BIOS loader or UEFI loader that's why I like BIOS booting as there is no need to digitally sign, you load anything in a way similar to bootkit, I always use flash disk for that way not to mess HDD, you even do not need to enter BIOS boot menu, you can add 512 bytes loader as a file into windows boot menu which loads the rest, this 512-bytes loader does not change, I just update the second stage on the USB flash disk
If I expect a lot of starts/stops of the hypervisor then rebooting PC just to start hypervisor only once is a slow process so then I prefer to start unsigned driver and in that case I select "disable digital signature enforcement" during win boot (also debug enabled and COM port cable connection to remote PC works the same way that you do not need digitally signed driver file) so I can start/stop unsigned hypervisor driver after each modification from running OS as many times as I want (usually until first OS crash as I do a development/implementing something new in this case)
basically I just need to save my time and sometimes the fastest way for me is BIOS booting and sometimes another way, e.g. implementing sleep/resume from ACPI S3 state required always booting the PC, as from running OS you do not bother with ACPI sleep/resume as you just install a power callback which notifies you before sleep (so you can stop) and calls your driver on resume (so you can start), but if you start before OS you have to deal with ACPI otherwise after sleep/resume the hypervisor would not be running anymore

[1] I installed win 11 to MBR partitioned disk, I booted into BIOS mode and loaded the ISO which was modified to pass these my desired settings - in fact, I did not use physical DVD disk either DVD drive, I just mounted the MBR partitioned HDD under VMWare (physical disk) and also the modified iso image (virtual disk), performed the first stage of installation and then stopped VMWare, rebooted the PC using boot menu into BIOS mode where the MBR disk was set as primary disk and then the installation completed (burning DVD is slow process and booting from it too, this way with vmware is very fast as the iso image is not read from DVD but from a file and in case of plenty of RAM even faster from the RAM cache)
so I did not touch my primary GPT partitioned disk at all and either UEFI boot menu and I installed everything into secondary HDD which is MBR partitioned

[2] if you would like to upgrade your running win 10 to win 11 via internet installer, then the installer creates a directory on your system partition where it copies files, which lasts a long time, during which you have plenty of time to manually delete the file which reports to OS that you booted via BIOS and are running from MBR partitioned disk (after deleting the nasty DLL nothing is reported of course)
I found it here:
https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/win-11-boot-and-upgrade-fix-kit-v2-0.83724/#post-1670052
Quote:
Method 1: REPLACING APPRAISERRES.DLL IN "C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\SOURCES" WITH THE DLL FROM A 1703 ISO
Method 2: RENAMING APPRAISERRES.DLL IN "C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\SOURCES"
Method 3: DELETING APPRAISERRES.DLL IN "C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\SOURCES"
All three shown methods will skip the minimum requirements when upgrading.

When you act fast enough, at just under 6% downloading the folder is created and the original appraiserres.dll is present, replace/rename/delete it and then you won't get the "this system doesn't meet the minimum requirements" message at all!

to editing the ISO to bypass the minimum requirements (UEFI boot, secure boot enabled, GPT partitioned disk, TPM 2.0), download the kit with a name Win_11_Boot_And_Upgrade_FiX_KiT_v2.0.zip from the first post of the thread:
https://forums.mydigitallife.net/threads/win-11-boot-and-upgrade-fix-kit-v2-0.83724/
at current date/time no need to register there to see the download links, here are they, the second one is a mirror:
https://kutt.luzea.ovh/oRG1Dq
https://kutt.luzea.ovh/Bh0Mad
they are encrypted and the passwd is:
MDL2021
that effectively modified my downloded iso image so I was able to boot it with the desired settings (BIOS mode and MBR partitioned disk attached = it kicked off UEFI necessity, Secure Boot necessity, GPT partitioned disk necessity, TPM 2.0 necessity)

just keep in mind that only installer checks the requirements (ver 22000.194), once you install to anything you like the OS does not check the requirements anymore Very Happy Twisted Evil
Post 18 Oct 2021, 17:24
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