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Index > MenuetOS > Unchained mode 13h?

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THEWizardGenius



Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 382
Location: California, USA
THEWizardGenius
I don't know if it makes much difference to you people who have VESA video cards, but I have a cheap motherboard-integrated graphics "card," and the VESA routines do not work on it. Because of this, and the fact that VGA mode 12h 640x480x16 is too slow and doesn't look good because of the lack of colors, I use mode 13h. The thing I don't like about it is that the resolution is so low! Can't you folks use unchained mode 13h?

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Post 04 Feb 2005, 03:24
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bubach



Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 341
Location: Trollhättan, Sweden
bubach
unchained mode 0x13 has the excact same resolution, so whats the point?
Post 04 Feb 2005, 18:08
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tom



Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Posts: 2
tom
not true. vgas are capable of doing higher resolutions such as 320x240, 320x400, 360x270, 400x300 and many more, all at 256 colors. the problem in chained mode is, that there's not enough video memory for such high resolutions. in unchained mode however, there is.

still i think it's pointless:

1) those nonstandard resolutions wont work on all cards/monitors
2) unchained mode vram access is godawfully slow
3) the resolution is higher, but imo still not high enough to be really useful
Post 05 Feb 2005, 15:30
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bubach



Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 341
Location: Trollhättan, Sweden
bubach
those modes are called modeX or similar... just unchaining mode 0x13 will give the exact same resolution...
Quote:
1) those nonstandard resolutions wont work on all cards/monitors

Michael Abrash, who "invented" modeX claims that his modeX setting code works on all VGA compatible cards. And i don't doubt that..

/ Christoffer
Post 07 Feb 2005, 10:03
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tom



Joined: 05 Feb 2005
Posts: 2
tom
the only mode abrash called modeX is 320x240x8, which works indeed pretty much everywhere.

other modes don't necessarily, especially those with a higher resolution (which the thread starter obviously had in mind, although he wrote "unchained mode 13h". this mode is sometimes refered to as modeY, btw)
Post 07 Feb 2005, 10:59
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bubach



Joined: 17 Sep 2004
Posts: 341
Location: Trollhättan, Sweden
bubach
320x240x256....
"modeX or similar" -> modeY, modeQ etc..
but i get your point.
Post 07 Feb 2005, 11:13
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THEWizardGenius



Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 382
Location: California, USA
THEWizardGenius
Yeah, modex, modey, modeq, etc. It's not much more useful, but it would be a little bit nicer I think... you should at least add it as an option... I mean, people with non-standard video cards have two options: Mode 13h (low resolution but good colors) or Mode 12h (highER resolution but terrible colors and really really slow).

BTW, I would like it if we didn't have to type all our options in every time we start up. After the first startup, it should have saved everything in a file which it uses next startup. If those settings don't work (like if a different computer is in use) it should ask the user to enter new settings, then optionally save them or just use them for this session only.

Also, when an error occurs during startup, it shouldn't hang- it should try again, or talk to the user.
Post 25 Feb 2005, 00:01
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JMD



Joined: 24 Sep 2003
Posts: 32
JMD
Quote:

BTW, I would like it if we didn't have to type all our options in every time we start up.

you dont have to, open kernel.asm and do a search for preboot. There will be 8 or 9 varibles there in the 16 bit code entry area where you can set pre-determined values for bootup. after making them what you want recompile kernel and copy it to your floppy.
Post 25 Feb 2005, 13:00
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JMD



Joined: 24 Sep 2003
Posts: 32
JMD
Quote:

After the first startup, it should have saved everything in a file which it uses next startup.

I agree as long as it is done properly. I dont think the community wants a real windows style registry but i do believe some type of initialzation file is an order.

Quote:

If those settings don't work (like if a different computer is in use) it should ask the user to enter new settings, then optionally save them or just use them for this session only.

it would be a little difficult for the OS to automatically know if the video setting is working correctly or not and i am pretty sure that would go for most other settings.

Quote:

Also, when an error occurs during startup, it shouldn't hang- it should try again, or talk to the user

you may have no choice for some unexpected errors, in that case it should halt the system and give some clue as to why the error occured.
Post 25 Feb 2005, 13:07
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THEWizardGenius



Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 382
Location: California, USA
THEWizardGenius
Well I'm just talking about when my computer starts up with MenuetOS. If I try to select a VESA mode (ANY VESA mode) it doesn't let me because my graphics card is non-standard or something. After it loads the RAMDISK (I'm using the floppy drive) it will say the video mode isn't supported by the card, and then hang. What I'm saying is that if that error or any other video-related error occurs, it would know enough to ask me what I want to do, rather than giving me an almost meaningless error message and then hanging (causing me to have to go through the agony of restarting and reloading the RAMDISK - this could be enough to cause any average person, like me, to, unlike me, quit using MenuetOS even before they have gotten it working).

And no, we don't want a stupid, bloated, cryptic list of things known as a "registry" (whatever THAT means)- only Windows wizards can use the registry very easily; I do a few things, but it's stupid, bloated, and for the most part, useless.
Post 01 Mar 2005, 18:58
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bloglite



Joined: 21 Feb 2004
Posts: 109
Location: East Tennessee U.S.A.
bloglite
Settings can be be preloaded but the hardware compatibility has to exist.

There is just too much "non-standardization" in the standards. VESA included.

We have recently acquired a wholesale lot of PCI video cards which we are testing for MeOS use.

so far 2 each of MenuetOS compatible PCI cards. max resolution listed.

Let us know if you need a compatible card.

S3 #9 VESA 1.2 1024x768

ATI Mach 64 VESA 2 800x600

Diamond Stealth 3D VESA 1.2 1024x768

S3 #9 Trio 64 VESA 1.2 800x600
Post 02 Mar 2005, 14:20
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JMD



Joined: 24 Sep 2003
Posts: 32
JMD
THEWizardGenius wrote:
And no, we don't want a stupid, bloated, cryptic list of things known as a "registry" (whatever THAT means)- only Windows wizards can use the registry very easily; I do a few things, but it's stupid, bloated, and for the most part, useless.


Hmm, well perhaps one needs a better understanding on how a computer works before making a judgement such as stupid and bloated. first of all i think the windows registry is the one of the best things that has been conceived when it is used properly. So by making a statement such as that it is very obvious you have extremenly limited experiance in programming in general. I am not saying that I am The Wizard Genius when it comes to programming but my experience tells me that 1. we need external initilization files in some situations, and 2. A single standard "registry" style structure is the best and most effiecient means of doing such a task. But if someone can come up with a better way of doing such task i am willing to listen. The following is the basis of my reasoning:

Applications sometimes need to store information and settings and reintialize to these settings each time the application (or operating system) is started. I find it very difficult and not feesible to store this information within the compiled file since changing and resaving these settings would be nearly impossible to implement properly in all situations, if at all.

This is where an external intialization file comes in. i believe we need some standard way of formating such external file and make it easy to implement in any application and within the kernel itself. I also believe that some aspects of the operating system need to be standardized, not only for operating system components like the loading drivers, common interface themes, or some extended features like autocomplete, context menu items, etc.

When you investigate how a harddrive operates and how it uses clusters to store information you can quickly see how using multiple and typicaly small size file to store limitied information on one application can equate to bloated and inefficeint use of the hardrive to store information. On the other hand, when you have a single standard "registry" or so to say, you get away from multiple small files and gain efficency in harddrive storage and reliablilty. What happens if one of your critical initialization files becomes corrupt? With a sigle "registry" style file it is very easy to make multiple backup copies which can be restored in case of an emergency.
Post 04 Mar 2005, 01:54
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